Jump to content


Photo

This Season I'm Most Excited For...


  • Please log in to reply
57 replies to this topic

#41 Thorny

Thorny

    Supreme Mugwump

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,547 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Buffalo, some day

Posted 16 August 2017 - 05:55 PM

Come on, at least give me a general range. I don't want you weaseling your way out of this as his career makes your claim look like the foolishness that it is.


He's saying his goals will go down this season, and his production as a whole will follow suit, relative to earlier seasons, once he signs his deal. I think that's a fairly laid out prediction.

#42 Randall Flagg

Randall Flagg

    All Star

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 13,028 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Oklahoma

Posted 16 August 2017 - 05:56 PM

General range for what exactly?   

Say something like "within 3 years of signing his big contract, he's a sub-50 point center."


He's saying his goals will go down this season, and his production as a whole will follow suit, relative to earlier seasons, once he signs his deal. I think that's a fairly laid out prediction.

So what you're saying is when Auston goes 35G-40A-75PTS we have another summer of listening to pi talk about how correct he is. Nice.


Edited by Randall Flagg, 16 August 2017 - 05:56 PM.


#43 Thorny

Thorny

    Supreme Mugwump

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,547 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Buffalo, some day

Posted 16 August 2017 - 06:02 PM

As soon as the "Standard 3 Mentioned" became "Crosby, McDavid, Matthews", pi's projection became, ill say it - a hell of a lot more believable, at least in terms of his idea that Matthews will be viewed as a disappointment.

Matthews will not be anywhere close to those other 2 in production. His playmaking abilities, as a centre, are nothing special (relative to what you'd expect from a #1 overall (Matthews is a very good playmaker)). He's widely been anointed as a top 3 player in the game already, and I would guess it's more likely than not he falls short of this.

When the world viewed Matthews as a very good to potentially elite player, likely to fall in the top 10, pi's projection was ludicrous. Auston's production won't drop off a cliff like he postulates, but Matthews being viewed as a disappointment is at least 50/50 at this point, considering Leafs fans legitimately believe he's in the Crosby McDavid class. He's not.

/hot take.

Edited by Thorny, 16 August 2017 - 06:04 PM.


#44 Randall Flagg

Randall Flagg

    All Star

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 13,028 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Oklahoma

Posted 16 August 2017 - 06:07 PM

As soon as the "Standard 3 Mentioned" became "Crosby, McDavid, Matthews", pi's projection became, ill say it - a hell of a lot more believable, at least in terms of his idea that Matthews will be viewed as a disappointment.

Matthews will not be anywhere close to those other 2 in production. His playmaking abilities, as a centre, are nothing special (relative to what you'd expect from a #1 overall (Matthews is a very good playmaker)). He's widely been anointed as a top 3 player in the game already, and I would guess it's more likely than not he falls short of this.

When the world viewed Matthews as a very good to potentially elite player, likely to fall in the top 10, pi's projection was ludicrous. Auston's production won't drop off a cliff like he postulates, but Matthews being viewed as a disappointment is at least 50/50 at this point, considering Leafs fans legitimately believe he's in the Crosby McDavid class. He's not.

/hot take.

But he had a whopping 3 fewer assists than elite center playmaker Jack did in his rookie year. Which is acceptable considering he blew Jack's goal totals out of the water. 

You're setting yourself up to be thoroughly miserable during Matthews' career, I'm afraid. 



#45 Thorny

Thorny

    Supreme Mugwump

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,547 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Buffalo, some day

Posted 16 August 2017 - 06:08 PM

https://twitter.com/...933485863714816

But he had a whopping 3 fewer assists than elite center playmaker Jack did in his rookie year. Which is acceptable considering he blew Jack's goal totals out of the water.
You're setting yourself up to be thoroughly miserable during Matthews' career, I'm afraid.


No, I'm not. If he's not at Crosby/McDavid's level, I'm satisfied. Do you really think he gets there?

Ya, Eichel had 3 more. Playing with inferior linemates and players in an inferior system. And remember Jack's freakishly slow start to his assist totals that year? He could/should have had ~ 5 or 10 before he actually got his first. No such case with Matthews.

Edited by Thorny, 16 August 2017 - 06:11 PM.


#46 Randall Flagg

Randall Flagg

    All Star

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 13,028 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Oklahoma

Posted 16 August 2017 - 06:09 PM

As a rookie he was 2nd in the NHL in goals, and was a huge reason why the Maple Leafs went from dead last to playoffs. 

Objectively speaking Auston should be considered a preseason MVP candidate. 



#47 Thorny

Thorny

    Supreme Mugwump

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,547 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Buffalo, some day

Posted 16 August 2017 - 06:19 PM

He's not getting to Sid and Connor's level. He was never projected to be such as a prospect, and won't reach that level now. I'll be satisfied, and not miserable.

His best shot at reaching a legitimate conversation with Crosby and McDavid is to become a very good player, and achieve playoff success with a very solid core being built in Toronto.

At that point, he'll achieve Toews status. Eternally overrated.

#48 Randall Flagg

Randall Flagg

    All Star

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 13,028 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Oklahoma

Posted 16 August 2017 - 06:27 PM

He's not getting to Sid and Connor's level. He was never projected to be such as a prospect, and won't reach that level now. I'll be satisfied, and not miserable.

His best shot at reaching a legitimate conversation with Crosby and McDavid is to become a very good player, and achieve playoff success with a very solid core being built in Toronto.

At that point, he'll achieve Toews status. Eternally overrated.

I have trouble talking in absolutes like that. 

 

Auston was 10 when Toews started his career and has already outscored Toews' highest goal total by 6, in a relatively low-scoring NHL.

 

I agree that it's not likely he plays in the stratosphere of those two. I've become resigned to the idea that he could operate on his own tier in between that one and the next one, by himself. 

 

The offseason is a time of healing, but I cannot forget the amount of times I wanted to drink myself into a blackout watching him play last year. Luckily I don't really drink. 


Edited by Randall Flagg, 16 August 2017 - 06:28 PM.


#49 Thorny

Thorny

    Supreme Mugwump

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,547 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Buffalo, some day

Posted 16 August 2017 - 06:43 PM

That's all fair. I still believe Jack will be as good if not better, but that imduvidual tier you speak of is definitely possible. I was speaking in absolutes for dramatic effect, but of course one can't know.

I do hope you saw my edit of a previous post, referring to Jack and Auston's assist discrepancy in their rookie years, as I truly believe they aren't close on a playmaking level. Matthews is more of a grinder, like Sid, which could very well lead to higher goal totals than Jack.

#50 pi2000

pi2000

    A. Matthews loves money more than hockey

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,825 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Left Coast

Posted 16 August 2017 - 07:09 PM

He's saying his goals will go down this season, and his production as a whole will follow suit, relative to earlier seasons, once he signs his deal. I think that's a fairly laid out prediction.

 

correct

 

 

Say something like "within 3 years of signing his big contract, he's a sub-50 point center."

 

Within 3 years of signing his big contract his production will decline and there will be questions raised about his commitment level.    Being in the center of the hockey universe in Toronto, this will get ugly.    I don't know that he'll drop to a 50pt player, but somewhere in the 25g/35a/60pt range within 3 years of his mega-deal.     He'll eventually be dealt to ARI where he'll resurrect his career, ableit briefly, before completely flaming out (drugs/alcohol a likely possibility) before the age of 30.

 

Is that specific enough for you?



#51 Randall Flagg

Randall Flagg

    All Star

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 13,028 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Oklahoma

Posted 16 August 2017 - 07:11 PM

correct

 

 

 

Within 3 years of signing his big contract his production will decline and there will be questions raised about his commitment level.    Being in the center of the hockey universe in Toronto, this will get ugly.    I don't know that he'll drop to a 50pt player, but somewhere in the 25g/35a/60pt range within 3 years of his mega-deal.     He'll eventually be dealt to ARI where he'll resurrect his career, ableit briefly, before completely flaming out (drugs/alcohol a likely possibility) before the age of 30.

 

Is that specific enough for you?

I guess. I expect better from someone who boasts this stance every chance they get, though. ;)



#52 mjd1001

mjd1001

    Top Prospect

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 361 posts

Posted 16 August 2017 - 07:13 PM

More goals. I just want more goals. Goals for (hopefully) I'll even take it with some goals against. I just don't want to sit in front of a TV watching a Sabres game and go 1+ hours and not seeing a puck in the net.



#53 Thorny

Thorny

    Supreme Mugwump

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,547 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Buffalo, some day

Posted 16 August 2017 - 07:45 PM

correct
 
 

 
Within 3 years of signing his big contract his production will decline and there will be questions raised about his commitment level.    Being in the center of the hockey universe in Toronto, this will get ugly.    I don't know that he'll drop to a 50pt player, but somewhere in the 25g/35a/60pt range within 3 years of his mega-deal.     He'll eventually be dealt to ARI where he'll resurrect his career, ableit briefly, before completely flaming out (drugs/alcohol a likely possibility) before the age of 30.
 
Is that specific enough for you?


Hahahaha. You are the best, Pi.

#54 ShadowLiger

ShadowLiger

    Second Liner

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,844 posts

Posted 16 August 2017 - 08:19 PM

Bookmark it!

#55 SwampD

SwampD

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 17,839 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:North Jersey, orig. NT

Posted 16 August 2017 - 09:02 PM

Oh, sweet baby Jeebus.



#56 Wyldnwoody44

Wyldnwoody44

    "Have no fear of perfection, You'll never reach it"

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,549 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Springville, NY

Posted 16 August 2017 - 09:30 PM

:(


Haha totally wasn't expecting this tangent, unfortunately it's gone, sorry to be a heart breaker

#57 North Buffalo

North Buffalo

    When hell freezes over, I’ll play hockey there too.

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,768 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Wherever Hockey is Being Played

Posted 16 August 2017 - 10:36 PM

That's all fair. I still believe Jack will be as good if not better, but that imduvidual tier you speak of is definitely possible. I was speaking in absolutes for dramatic effect, but of course one can't know.
I do hope you saw my edit of a previous post, referring to Jack and Auston's assist discrepancy in their rookie years, as I truly believe they aren't close on a playmaking level. Matthews is more of a grinder, like Sid, which could very well lead to higher goal totals than Jack.


Agree with the grinding part and he is a lot bigger than Sid... heard recently he weight close to Ovi range 240. That's a bulldog type with good hockey sense. Hard to knock him off his skates and has a nose for the net. Not sure who he compares to stylistically. Maybe a shorter version of a young JVR... but not sure hmmm, Toews with lbs?
Got nothing on Pi going out on a limb.... guess go big or go home...

#58 WildCard

WildCard

    Gunner's Mate First Class: Philip A$$hole

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 21,859 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Lost in a Supermarket

Posted 16 August 2017 - 10:38 PM

Within 3 years of signing his big contract his production will decline and there will be questions raised about his commitment level.    Being in the center of the hockey universe in Toronto, this will get ugly.    I don't know that he'll drop to a 50pt player, but somewhere in the 25g/35a/60pt range within 3 years of his mega-deal.     He'll eventually be dealt to ARI where he'll resurrect his career, ableit briefly, before completely flaming out (drugs/alcohol a likely possibility) before the age of 30.

 

Is that specific enough for you?

At this point you just can't change the Matthews avatar