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Expansion draft and league-wide wheeling and dealing

trades before Free Agency

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#81 DarthEbriate

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 01:28 PM

Patrick Kane is 29 and on the most expensive contract in the league.
Elite talent, but the price isn't going to be as high as his stature deserves.

Exactly. He's making 13 and 12 the next two seasons before his salary drops a bit for the close of the deal. Chicago absolutely needs cap space --- but there's no need to sell the farm for him. Chicago can demand all they want, they're not clearing 13 million just on one team. They're taking a contract/someone to insert into the lineup and keep contending for a Cup, and 2 others (pick and young talent).

 

For example: Kane for Kane + 8 + Nylander or Reinhart (never both). At the most. I'd even push for that 8 to be our highest second. Taking PKane and 13/12M means no defensive upgrade and losing Reinhart next season. We'd be paying O'Reilly, Eichel, and PKane's more than Pittsburgh pays Crosby, Malkin, and Kessel.



#82 ShadowLiger

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 01:33 PM

Exactly. He's making 13 and 12 the next two seasons before his salary drops a bit for the close of the deal. Chicago absolutely needs cap space --- but there's no need to sell the farm for him. Chicago can demand all they want, they're not clearing 13 million just on one team. They're taking a contract/someone to insert into the lineup and keep contending for a Cup, and 2 others (pick and young talent).

 

For example: Kane for Kane + 8 + Nylander or Reinhart (never both). At the most. I'd even push for that 8 to be our highest second. Taking PKane and 13/12M means no defensive upgrade and losing Reinhart next season. We'd be paying O'Reilly, Eichel, and PKane's more than Pittsburgh pays Crosby, Malkin, and Kessel.

Why would we lose Reinhart next season?



#83 DarthEbriate

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 01:59 PM

Why would we lose Reinhart next season?

After next season when Reinhart and Eichel get to the next contract. Or we're trading O'Reilly or maybe Okposo if he waives his no movement clause.

 

Hypothetically in 19/20 we'd pay O'Reilly 8.5, Eichel ... what 8+? 9+?, Okposo 6, and PKane 9.8. That's half your cap hit in only 4 forwards. That's where the Blackhawks are now, and...they're over the cap.

 

At that point, I think we've got to move Reinhart if he's going to make 5M (which, I'd think he'd hit 50 points if he plays top 6 and PP and has Patrick Kane or Eichel as a linemate). I'd ask for that much if I'm his agent.



#84 Lanny

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 02:02 PM

Salary paid and cap hit aren't the same. I'm hopeful Eichel would come in under $7M



#85 DarthEbriate

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 02:17 PM

Salary paid and cap hit aren't the same. I'm hopeful Eichel would come in under $7M

Ach! Make me do more research....  by cap hit:

P Kane 10.5

O'Reilly 7.5

Okposo 6

Eichel (Tarasenko is the youngest/most recent and is at 7.5). So... maybe 7? Likely 7.5 or more if Eichel averages 1 ppg next year.

 

And let's say the cap hovers around 75M (and will until another team joins the league... so maybe for 19/20 Seattle is in and we're up to 80M)

OK, gotta get back to work....



#86 ShadowLiger

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 02:38 PM

After next season when Reinhart and Eichel get to the next contract. Or we're trading O'Reilly or maybe Okposo if he waives his no movement clause.

 

Hypothetically in 19/20 we'd pay O'Reilly 8.5, Eichel ... what 8+? 9+?, Okposo 6, and PKane 9.8. That's half your cap hit in only 4 forwards. That's where the Blackhawks are now, and...they're over the cap.

 

At that point, I think we've got to move Reinhart if he's going to make 5M (which, I'd think he'd hit 50 points if he plays top 6 and PP and has Patrick Kane or Eichel as a linemate). I'd ask for that much if I'm his agent.

I have no idea where these numbers are coming from. ROR makes 7.5 against the cap. Eichel will probably be around 6-7 if he is signed this July (every comparable player makes less then that and McDavid doesn't count). Okposo does make 6. Kane at 9.8mil is not freaking happening. If that is 9 or 8mil that is not freaking happening. He might get 6.5. Reinhart at 5mil might be a touch high. I would say if he signs this July you get him for around 4.5mil. 

 

7.5+6.5+6+4.5+ lets say 6.5 for Kane. That is 31 million or 41% of this seasons cap for 5 players. That isn't to crazy for a core group of forwards. 

 

On defense you have 5.4mil for Risto, McCabe at 1.6, and Bogosian at 5.14 (these are guys with contracts through 2018). That is about 16% of the cap. Granted you can give McCabe a raise from 1.6 to 4.25 after this season so let's say that happens. That's about 20% of the cap. So that means 61% of the cap would be tied up in 8 players. Seems about how normal teams operate. 


Edited by ShadowLiger, 14 June 2017 - 02:41 PM.


#87 BRAWNDO

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 04:07 PM

Hearing a lot of rumblings that a Drouin/Galchenyuk swap is coming...I'm no tradebreaker, so take it for what it's worth.


again, nothing definitive, but sounds like the Habs would be packaging a first with Galchenyuk in the deal.


From Conor McKenna TSN 690 Morning Host
From McKenzie

For those asking, NHL trade/waiver freeze and signing moratorium runs from 3 pm ET Sat. June 17 until 8 am ET Thur June 22. EXCEPT...


...Beginning 10 am ET on Sun June 18, VGK can make deals with other clubs tho those 30 clubs can only make deals with VGK until freeze ends.

Edited by BRAWNDO, 14 June 2017 - 04:00 PM.


#88 dudacek

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 04:20 PM

I know I'm in the minority on Drouin, but I don't think he will be any better than Galchenyuk.
Smacks of a French hero move by the Habs.

From the other side, good value for TB, but it hardly addresses their cap crunch or their need for a DMan.
Now if they flip Gally for Vatanen...

#89 WildCard

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 04:21 PM

Galchenyuck and a late first seems like a good trade for Tampa.

#90 TrueBlueGED

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 04:26 PM

I know I'm in the minority on Drouin, but I don't think he will be any better than Galchenyuk.
Smacks of a French hero move by the Habs.

From the other side, good value for TB, but it hardly addresses their cap crunch or their need for a DMan.
Now if they flip Gally for Vatanen...


I was thinking it sets them up nicely to move Johnson for a Dman, assuming Yzerman sees Galchenyuk as a center.

Galchenyuck and a late first seems like a good trade for Tampa.


Agreed.

#91 dudacek

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 04:51 PM

I was thinking it sets them up nicely to move Johnson for a Dman, assuming Yzerman sees Galchenyuk as a center.


That too.

#92 Thorny

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 07:53 PM

Galchenyuck and a late first seems like a good trade for Tampa.


Yup. This trade at least on paper seems reasonable for both sides. Montreal probably loses on it a bit due to how much they've devalued Galchenyuk.

I'm worried that's the kinda thing Reinhart is headed for.

Edited by Thorny, 14 June 2017 - 07:54 PM.


#93 Ducky

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 08:08 PM

The Habs make out better here. Drouin has more moves than a pail of worms. A much more dynamic player and giving up Gal and a late 1st isn't a steal but the Habs come out ahead especially since they have more RFA years.



#94 Thorny

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 08:11 PM

The Habs make out better here. Drouin has more moves than a pail of worms. A much more dynamic player and giving up Gal and a late 1st isn't a steal but the Habs come out ahead especially since they have more RFA years.


It could hinge on where Galchenyuk ends up playing. He's a natural centre, and the Habs weren't using him there. If he can fill a centre role for Tampa, it could swing the deal in their favour, as centres are so much more valuable than wingers.

#95 Ducky

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 08:30 PM

Good point. I don't watch them enough but was he not being used at center for a reason? The D resposibilities of a C in his own zone are almost like a D man (in most systems). Lots of centers get converted to wingers once they make the NHL.

I'd love to have Drouin on the Jets but the asking price would probably be too high.



#96 Thorny

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 08:39 PM

Good point. I don't watch them enough but was he not being used at center for a reason? The D resposibilities of a C in his own zone are almost like a D man (in most systems). Lots of centers get converted to wingers once they make the NHL.
I'd love to have Drouin on the Jets but the asking price would probably be too high.


Ya I didn't see enough of the Habs to be sure, either. Probably D-related as you alluded to.

Drouin is certainly more purely talented.

#97 ShadowLiger

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 08:41 PM

Good point. I don't watch them enough but was he not being used at center for a reason? The D resposibilities of a C in his own zone are almost like a D man (in most systems). Lots of centers get converted to wingers once they make the NHL.

I'd love to have Drouin on the Jets but the asking price would probably be too high.

Who's Winnipeg drafting? Any thoughts?



#98 Thorny

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 08:42 PM

Who's Winnipeg drafting? Any thoughts?


Valimaki, cause they draft well.

#99 TheCerebral1

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 08:45 PM

Unless they're taking back salary, and biting 20%, I say no thanks.  Patrick Kane is a fabulous player, but he's had nothing but bad run in's in Buffalo.  So let's bring him home.  Pass.  The assets and re-working of the roster it would take is a tragedy if you add Kane.



#100 ShadowLiger

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 08:51 PM

Valimaki, cause they draft well.

They drafted Logan Stanley so they don't draft that well. 



#101 Thorny

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 08:53 PM

They drafted Logan Stanley so they don't draft that well.


I was actually going to put that caveat in, haha. Good call.

#102 apuszczalowski

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 09:14 PM

Are the Rangers blowing it up?

They are also buying out Girardi



#103 TheCerebral1

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 09:41 PM

They are also buying out Girardi

 

I would say they're adjusting on the fly.  They've committed too many dollars to stay at home defensemen for sure.  It was pick one: Staal or Girardi. 



#104 ShadowLiger

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 10:37 PM

I was actually going to put that caveat in, haha. Good call.

Lol, they honestly don't draft bad. They are pretty average just like Buffalo

#105 Ducky

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Posted 14 June 2017 - 11:48 PM

Scheifele, Trouba, Morrissey, Ehers, Connor and Roslovic, Laine and Stanley.....not bad for first round picks.

#106 ShadowLiger

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Posted 15 June 2017 - 08:07 AM

Scheifele, Trouba, Morrissey, Ehers, Connor and Roslovic, Laine and Stanley.....not bad for first round picks.

If you don't include Stanley yea. Again they aren't bad at drafting. 



#107 Thorny

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Posted 15 June 2017 - 08:42 AM

If you don't include Stanley yea. Again they aren't bad at drafting.


Ya, I mean, Scheifele, Ehlers, Laine, Connor and probably Trouba look to be great picks. And only Laine was a no-brainer. I remember there being a decent outcry here when Scheifele was drafted, with Couturier still on the board. I liked the pick at the time.

Jury out on Morrissey and Roslovic, but Stanley seems to be the only bust of a pick.

#108 ShadowLiger

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Posted 15 June 2017 - 08:54 AM

I mean realistically we can't judge Stanley yet but that wasn't a good pick. They wanted a defender I think and so they took the biggest one in the general area. Still better than when Boston took Zachary Senyshyn over Barzal, Connor, Boeser, Konecny,Aho and Carlo. 



#109 WildCard

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Posted 15 June 2017 - 10:07 AM

It was confirmed on Thursday morning that Teravainen has inked a two-year extension with the club, worth $2.86 million per season. Once the deal expires, the Finnish-born skater will become a restricted free agent once again.

 
https://www.fanragsp...ion-hurricanes/
 

“So again, I think that he’s appropriately on our Trade Bait list where he should be because that’s exactly what the Montreal Canadiens are using him as right now – trade bait. I’m curious to see what the return would have to be. If we look at Colorado, is it Matt Duchene. And is it a one-for-one. Galchenyuk is obviously bit younger. Is it Galchenyuk and something. Is it Duchene and something. I don’t know.
 
“I just know that the Montreal Canadiens need offense, so if you’re pushing out an offensive piece, what you’re getting back in return has got to be better than what you just gave up.”

“There’s teams with interest in Galchenyuk, as there should be,” said Dreger. “I mean, it was suggested to me that the Pittsburgh Penguins might have interest. And I don’t know what the Pittsburgh Penguins would have that would make sense to Marc Bergevin and the Montreal Canadiens, but I can appreciate why the Pens would have interest in Galchenyuk when you look at their pending unrestricted free agent list. The look of the Pittsburgh Penguins is going to be much different next year just naturally with their UFAs and their restricted free agents.

 
https://www.fanragsp...est-galchenyuk/


Edited by WildCard, 15 June 2017 - 10:08 AM.


#110 North Buffalo

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Posted 15 June 2017 - 01:26 PM

Saw today on twitter Chris Neal will not be resigned by Ottowa.... ahhh tooo bad good ridence.

#111 BRAWNDO

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Posted 15 June 2017 - 02:15 PM

Holy ######

The Canadiens acquire Jonathan Drouin + a cond. 6th-round pick (2018) from TBL, in return for M. Sergachev + a cond. 2nd-round pick (2018).

#112 ShadowLiger

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Posted 15 June 2017 - 02:17 PM

giphy.gif



#113 Randall Flagg

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Posted 15 June 2017 - 02:17 PM

Hot damn :o



#114 d4rksabre

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Posted 15 June 2017 - 02:18 PM

Holy ######

The Canadiens acquire Jonathan Drouin + a cond. 6th-round pick (2018) from TBL, in return for M. Sergachev + a cond. 2nd-round pick (2018).

That seems like a pretty good deal for Montreal. 



#115 Thorny

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Posted 15 June 2017 - 02:18 PM

Holy ######
The Canadiens acquire Jonathan Drouin + a cond. 6th-round pick (2018) from TBL, in return for M. Sergachev + a cond. 2nd-round pick (2018).


Wow. Huge deal.

So Drouin buys you a defensive prospect (Albeit, a very good one).

It's unlikely Kane (and maybe even Reinhart) is going to fetch us a return I'd be ok with.

#116 Drunkard

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Posted 15 June 2017 - 02:20 PM

I would have thought Drouin was worth more. I guess this shows the increasing value of defensemen and defensive prospects. It should start to skew the draft values of defensive prospects I would expect.



#117 Thorny

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Posted 15 June 2017 - 02:21 PM

I would have thought Drouin was worth more. I guess this shows the increasing value of defensemen and defensive prospects. It should start to skew the draft values of defensive prospects I would expect.


Agreed. D at 8 or bust.

#118 Drunkard

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Posted 15 June 2017 - 02:22 PM

It also brings up an interesting question. Sergachev was drafted #9 last year so we definitely could have had him instead of Nylander. One year later, would you rather have Nylander, Sergachev, or Drouin? I'd rather have Drouin or Sergachev and likely Drouin. Imagine having him playing with Eichel now instead of having to wait for Nylander to develop.


Edited by Drunkard, 15 June 2017 - 02:25 PM.


#119 Sabres79

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Posted 15 June 2017 - 02:27 PM

I would have thought Drouin was worth more. I guess this shows the increasing value of defensemen and defensive prospects. It should start to skew the draft values of defensive prospects I would expect.


I could have sworn the rumor was Galcenyuk going the other way earlier this morning. Odd. MTL wins this one.

#120 WildCard

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Posted 15 June 2017 - 02:31 PM

Holy ######

The Canadiens acquire Jonathan Drouin + a cond. 6th-round pick (2018) from TBL, in return for M. Sergachev + a cond. 2nd-round pick (2018).

Wow, that is an absurd deal for Montreal

 

 

That means Galchenyuck is definitely moving somewhere. I'd put money on a Duchene <=> Galchenyuck swap