Jump to content


Photo

Buffalo Bills 2017-18

Bills 2017 Miracles

  • Please log in to reply
4301 replies to this topic

#4281 Randall Flagg

Randall Flagg

    All Star

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,421 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Oklahoma

Posted 16 November 2017 - 11:34 PM

It's not the position comparison I'm arguing; I chose Reinhart for the same reason. I'm arguing skill level. 

I'd take about as many QBs over TT as I would centers over Jack right now. Maybe fewer.


Crosby, Malkin, McDavid, Matthews, Barkov, Stamkos, Tavares, Kopitar, Scheifele are all playing way better off the top of my head, and just looking now he's 24th in scoring among centers, and is certainly not a good enough defensive player to bump him up from that spot.

I expect Jack to be better, but for tomorrow's game I take plenty of guys over him.



#4282 That Aud Smell

That Aud Smell

    That Nostalgic Olfactory Blend

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,883 posts
  • Gender:Not Telling
  • Location:Bobcaygeon, Ontario

Posted Yesterday, 05:37 AM

Benching Tyrod is tantamount to benching or trading Lehner or *Eichel*?

Sheesh, for different reasons.

I’m more on board with the trading Reinhart scenario.

#4283 Huckleberry

Huckleberry

    First Liner

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,533 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Brussels, Belgium

Posted Yesterday, 08:06 AM

If peterman does well, McDermott will look shut us all up :P



#4284 Eleven

Eleven

    Drunk Trailer Park Supervisor

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 29,510 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Bobcaygeon, Ontario

Posted Yesterday, 10:01 AM

If peterman does well, McDermott will look shut us all up :P

 

Hey, I'm hoping he wins out and is the next Tom Brady.

 

I don't think that's what's going to happen, though.



#4285 dudacek

dudacek

    ...browsing the internet

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 10,821 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Listening to offers — eyes and ears

Posted Yesterday, 10:25 AM

If you are making a hockey comparison, it has to be with a goalie, no one else in hockey has the same impact on the game as a QB.
Tyrod to Lehner is pretty bang on.

#4286 Randall Flagg

Randall Flagg

    All Star

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,421 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Oklahoma

Posted Yesterday, 10:33 AM

The top 3 goalies in the league over the past 5 years haven't even sniffed a cup final. I hate a goalie-qb comparison.

#4287 SwampD

SwampD

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 18,304 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:North Jersey, orig. NT

Posted Yesterday, 11:11 AM

The top 3 goalies in the league over the past 5 years haven't even sniffed a cup final. I hate a goalie-qb comparison.

Drew Brees and Aaron Rodgers haven't sniffed the SB in that time either.

 

And Quick won two SCs. (he was the best at one time)



#4288 WildCard

WildCard

    Gunner's Mate First Class: Philip A$$hole

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 22,686 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Lost in a Supermarket

Posted Yesterday, 11:17 AM

Drew Brees and Aaron Rodgers haven't sniffed the SB in that time either.

 

And Quick won two SCs. (he was the best at one time)

Rodgers has made it to a few NFC championship games I think

 

Was Quick the best at that time? I don't feel like he was



#4289 North Buffalo

North Buffalo

    When hell freezes over, I’ll play hockey there too.

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,067 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Wherever Hockey is Being Played

Posted Yesterday, 11:18 AM

At least McD is not doing the same old same old... we know that result... its just Billsy. PS not saying TT wont be back, but he needs a breather. Seems to me that he has been pressing too much the last couple games and become paralyzed because of it. He decision making is more hesitant than normal. Have take a break and restart himself..

#4290 WildCard

WildCard

    Gunner's Mate First Class: Philip A$$hole

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 22,686 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Lost in a Supermarket

Posted Yesterday, 11:18 AM

If you are making a hockey comparison, it has to be with a goalie, no one else in hockey has the same impact on the game as a QB.
Tyrod to Lehner is pretty bang on.

Crosby and Karlsson beg to differ



#4291 Randall Flagg

Randall Flagg

    All Star

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,421 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Oklahoma

Posted Yesterday, 12:32 PM

Drew Brees and Aaron Rodgers haven't sniffed the SB in that time either.

 

And Quick won two SCs. (he was the best at one time)

But they have won Super Bowls in their primes. Price won't ever come close to a cup and he's the best goalie to play since Hasek. The best QB since Montana has certainly won one or two, or five, Super Bowls. 

Goalies don't really have an NFL comparable at all. Centers drive the play in the most quarterback-like manner. Or Erik Karlsson, but he's a position-wide exception. There are like 3 defensemen in NHL history who have EK's impact on a game when on the ice. 


Edited by Randall Flagg, Yesterday, 12:33 PM.


#4292 dudacek

dudacek

    ...browsing the internet

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 10,821 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Listening to offers — eyes and ears

Posted Yesterday, 12:49 PM

The top 3 goalies in the league over the past 5 years haven't even sniffed a cup final. I hate a goalie-qb comparison.


Dan Marino and Jim Kelly won as many Super Bowls as Carey Price and Henrik Lundqvist won cups.
Same for Dilfer and Hostetler and Osgood and Crawford.

The positions are unique because the game always goes through them, no matter how good or bad they are.

#4293 Randall Flagg

Randall Flagg

    All Star

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,421 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Oklahoma

Posted Yesterday, 01:01 PM

Dan Marino and Jim Kelly won as many Super Bowls as Carey Price and Henrik Lundqvist won cups.
Same for Dilfer and Hostetler and Osgood and Crawford.

The positions are unique because the game always goes through them, no matter how good or bad they are.

But even you have said that there are 20 goalies in the league that are interchangeable over the course of a season, it only matters if you have one in the top ~5 or the bottom ~5. I KNOW you've said this. I know loads of us have said something to that effect. I agree with it. This is the least true thing you could possibly say about a quarterback. 


Dan Marino and Jim Kelly won as many Super Bowls as Carey Price and Henrik Lundqvist won cups.
Same for Dilfer and Hostetler and Osgood and Crawford.

The positions are unique because the game always goes through them, no matter how good or bad they are.

They went to six. Holtby, Price, and Bobrovsky have won like 3 playoff rounds combined over the last 3-5 years. Even WITH Holtby posting borderline historic playoff goaltending stats, he's never been out of the 2nd round. Because the qb-like position on their team was dominated by the best qb-like player in the league at the time, center Sidney Crosby.


Edited by Randall Flagg, Yesterday, 01:00 PM.


#4294 dudacek

dudacek

    ...browsing the internet

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 10,821 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Listening to offers — eyes and ears

Posted Yesterday, 01:04 PM

I don’t think quarterback tiers break down the same way as the goalie tiers do, but I think that Lehner and Tyrod are both in that category of not going win unless you have all the pieces clicking around them.

That’s the same for most goalies and most QBs.
Could Russell Wilson win with last year’s Bills? Could Tyrod win with the Super Bowl Seahawks?

Edited by dudacek, Yesterday, 01:06 PM.


#4295 Randall Flagg

Randall Flagg

    All Star

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,421 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Oklahoma

Posted Yesterday, 02:01 PM

http://www.cover1.ne...gainst-saints/ 

Article with technical stuff about TT's game against the Saints. Argues that he shouldn't have been benched. I didn't understand a lot of it but it was fun to read.



#4296 dudacek

dudacek

    ...browsing the internet

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 10,821 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Listening to offers — eyes and ears

Posted Yesterday, 02:02 PM

Am I correct in reading your argument as saying goalies and QBs aren’t comparable because you can win without a great goalie, but you can’t win without a great QB? And/or great goalies are no guarantee of success, but great QBs are?

I think saying you have to have an elite QB to win is about as accurate as saying you have to tank to acquire elite talent.
The fact of the matter is all those things do is improve your chances.

To win you have to have a combination of better talent, better coaching and better timing, in other words, a better, luckier team.
There is no magic formula.

Edited by dudacek, Yesterday, 02:02 PM.


#4297 WildCard

WildCard

    Gunner's Mate First Class: Philip A$$hole

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 22,686 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Lost in a Supermarket

Posted Yesterday, 02:14 PM

Am I correct in reading your argument as saying goalies and QBs aren’t comparable because you can win without a great goalie, but you can’t win without a great QB? And/or great goalies are no guarantee of success, but great QBs are?

I think saying you have to have an elite QB to win is about as accurate as saying you have to tank to acquire elite talent.
The fact of the matter is all those things do is improve your chances.


To win you have to have a combination of better talent, better coaching and better timing, in other words, a better, luckier team.
There is no magic formula.

Good analogy. Worth noting that those changes improve a significant amount though. We're talking like, 80% better chance



#4298 Randall Flagg

Randall Flagg

    All Star

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 14,421 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Oklahoma

Posted Yesterday, 02:17 PM

Am I correct in reading your argument as saying goalies and QBs aren’t comparable because you can win without a great goalie, but you can’t win without a great QB? And/or great goalies are no guarantee of success, but great QBs are?

I think saying you have to have an elite QB to win is about as accurate as saying you have to tank to acquire elite talent.
The fact of the matter is all those things do is improve your chances.

To win you have to have a combination of better talent, better coaching and better timing, in other words, a better, luckier team.
There is no magic formula.

Pretty much. And those aren't hard statements, but generally speaking I'm quite comfortable with saying that any given year there's a 90% chance that the QB that wins the super bowl is top 10 and a 75% chance he's top 5 that given season (Peyton Manning a notable exception to the first one, on the back of the best defense I've ever seen in my life) whereas I'm almost always unimpressed by the finals goalies recently and we've almost never seen the very very best goalies win cups, and the list of top centers likely correlates a lot more with quarterback rankings and successes. Coupled with the fact that they relate in their driving of the play of the sport, rather than just stopping pucks and having NOTHING to do with what you'd call "the play of the game itself", I just like that comparison better. 

Fully agreed with the last part. The rest just gets so much easier with the 1C/QB of your dreams, which is why they're coveted.



#4299 FuhrFury

FuhrFury

    Fourth Liner

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 705 posts
  • Gender:Not Telling

Posted Yesterday, 04:31 PM

http://www.cover1.ne...gainst-saints/ 

Article with technical stuff about TT's game against the Saints. Argues that he shouldn't have been benched. I didn't understand a lot of it but it was fun to read.

 

I think this author's definition of a receiver being "open" or an offensive line giving a QB "enough time" differs from most pro football analysts. It is also important to note that Taylor is probably not being benched solely due to the New Orleans game. There were definite trends in Tyrod's game all season (and career, really) that just happened to be maximally exploited by a very good Saints defense.

 

I'm a bit surprised by how many Bills fans and also how many national media personalities hate the QB switch and aren't giving Peterman a chance. The Bills are going up against arguably the best pass rushing defense in the NFL and a head coach who is very familiar with Tyrod Taylor. I can see why Coach McDermott wants to go to a different QB known for being smart, confident, aggressive, and possessing a very quick release. The Chargers are supposedly practicing this week as if they can face either QB, so this is a slight competitive advantage if it makes them waste extra preparation time on Taylor.

 

On the subject of the AFC playoff race, I was glancing at the remaining schedules for our wild card competitiors. Here's what I've determined: the Jags, Titans, and Ravens have ridiculously easy schedules and so should probably be considered the favorites to fill out the remaining 3 playoff seeds after the Pats, Steelers, and Chiefs. I'm not even so sure 9-7 will be enough to secure a wild card spot.



#4300 JujuFish

JujuFish

    Qwerty

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,592 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted Yesterday, 07:11 PM

The Bills are going up against arguably the best pass rushing defense in the NFL

 

The Chargers are #6 in DVOA against the pass.  However, they're only 22nd against the rush.  I hope McCoy's on his game.



#4301 WildCard

WildCard

    Gunner's Mate First Class: Philip A$$hole

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 22,686 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Lost in a Supermarket

Posted Yesterday, 08:01 PM

The Chargers are #6 in DVOA against the pass. However, they're only 22nd against the rush. I hope McCoy's on his game.

Peterman is gonna have his hands full against Bosa and that other edge rusher

#4302 Eleven

Eleven

    Drunk Trailer Park Supervisor

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 29,510 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Bobcaygeon, Ontario

Posted Today, 07:59 AM

Rivers is out of concussion protocol and will play tomorrow.







Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: Bills, 2017, Miracles