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#81 jsb

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Posted 24 December 2016 - 09:22 AM

Interesting thread! For those with diminishing or no spiritual beliefs, how do you treat Christian holidays? Is Christmas strictly a family holiday where it's all about the meal and gifts? (Let's be honest, that's what it is for a majority of the US regardless of spirituality). How about other big ones like Easter?

Actually Easter is the biggest holiday of the Christian/Catholic Religion. It's the basis for one's faith, the Resurrection of Christ.

Christmas unfortunately has become the Capitalist version of His birth.

 

 

I like the idea of a faith thread.

 

My journey is not complete by any means.  In many ways it is still just beginning.

 

I have witnessed many things that have turned my off of Islam as it is widely practiced these days, but I remain a 'muslim' and am trying my best to follow real 'islam'.  

 

Salam / Peace.

Good luck to you, but following the previous post above, what or do you celebrate anything during this Holiday Season??? Curious, is it just a day off or a family affair or is there something in the Islamic Faith that also occurs this time of year.



#82 Drunkard

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Posted 24 December 2016 - 09:46 AM

Interesting thread! For those with diminishing or no spiritual beliefs, how do you treat Christian holidays? Is Christmas strictly a family holiday where it's all about the meal and gifts? (Let's be honest, that's what it is for a majority of the US regardless of spirituality). How about other big ones like Easter?


I celebrate the commercialization of the holiday basically. Presents and food and spending time with family and enjoying time off work. No church or anything like that and no birthday cake for Jesus (not sure if anyone does that but I used to joke that we should do it growing up).

Easter is easter baskets and candy for kids with a small gift sometimes and a family meal but again no church or anything like that. Not sure about any other religious dates/holidays so if there are any important enough to list that I forgot they are ignored. I honestly can't remember the last time I was in a church (more than 10 years ago) except for occassionally being in the small built in chapel at the fueral home where my older brother works (he's a funeral director). No services were being held any time I was there though.

#83 Sabres Fan In NS

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Posted 25 December 2016 - 01:27 PM

Actually Easter is the biggest holiday of the Christian/Catholic Religion. It's the basis for one's faith, the Resurrection of Christ.

Christmas unfortunately has become the Capitalist version of His birth.

 

 

Good luck to you, but following the previous post above, what or do you celebrate anything during this Holiday Season??? Curious, is it just a day off or a family affair or is there something in the Islamic Faith that also occurs this time of year.

 

Sorry for my late reply, just noticed this now.

 

In Islam there is no 'official' recognition, or celebration, of Christmas.  That said, reasonable Muslims will often participate in Christmas festivities ... taking a meal with friends who celebrate the holiday, feeding the poor, visiting the sick etc.

 

My wife and I are going to have Christmas dinner with good friends and neighbours and then we will be going to spend the evening with our friend (the one I visit every Friday) who is confined to a wheel chair.  He happens to be a Muslim, but I just called him and we wished each other Merry Christmas.  Why not, right?

 

Now there are many Muslims out there that would not agree with my view on it, but we all view Jesus (PBUH) as a great man and a messenger of God.  So, what is the big deal in celebrating his birth?

 

Peace.



#84 rjones71

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Posted 25 December 2016 - 01:37 PM

Sorry for my late reply, just noticed this now.
 
In Islam there is no 'official' recognition, or celebration, of Christmas.  That said, reasonable Muslims will often participate in Christmas festivities ... taking a meal with friends who celebrate the holiday, feeding the poor, visiting the sick etc.
 
My wife and I are going to have Christmas dinner with good friends and neighbours and then we will be going to spend the evening with our friend (the one I visit every Friday) who is confined to a wheel chair.  He happens to be a Muslim, but I just called him and we wished each other Merry Christmas.  Why not, right?
 
Now there are many Muslims out there that would not agree with my view on it, but we all view Jesus (PBUH) as a great man and a messenger of God.  So, what is the big deal in celebrating his birth?
 
Peace.


I know very little about Islam or Muslims, but I do know an intelligent, honest man when I read what he writes. So, if I may, Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays to you and yours.

#85 Sabres Fan In NS

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Posted 25 December 2016 - 02:05 PM

I know very little about Islam or Muslims, but I do know an intelligent, honest man when I read what he writes. So, if I may, Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays to you and yours.

 

Thank you, kind sir.

 

You certainly may and I will greet you back with Merry Christmas to you and yours.



#86 Peppy22

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Posted 25 December 2016 - 06:05 PM

I can make that a quick answer

 

I don't believe in god. For me there is nothing like jesus or allah or whatsoever... I think religion has brought the most pain to this world leading to wars and people being stubborn about accepting other people.

 

If you believe in god or any other higher thing thats fine with me... If you stop a conversation with me because you have to pray. thats fine with me Ill just wait and let you finish. I can accept whatever people believe in... But I hate and by hate I mean people who try to convince people that they are wrong when it comes to religion or that are unable to understand that people who believe in a different religion handle certain situations in their lives different....

 

keep religion to yourself and live it but don't drag people into it...



#87 Sabres Fan In NS

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Posted 07 January 2017 - 01:42 PM

Merry Christmas to any Orthodox Christians out there in SabreSpace.



#88 Drunkard

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Posted 08 January 2017 - 10:32 PM

Merry Christmas to any Orthodox Christians out there in SabreSpace.


Is that a 12 days of Christmas type thing? I was born and raised Catholic but I had some ancestors that were Russian and White Russian (Belarus) so they were likely Orthodox Christian. Don't know much about Eastern Orthodox other it's the predominant "brand" of Christianity for Greeks and Russkies though.

#89 Doohickie

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Posted 08 January 2017 - 10:38 PM

So.... like....our church got vandalized Saturday night/Sunday morning.  :(
 

Windows were shattered and furniture was busted. Books had been ripped apart, and food and containers had been stacked on a stove and torched. The vandal or vandals broke into the education building of the century-old church early Sunday, forcing church officials to cancel morning services.


There is a slight factual error though. The congregation is 130 years old, but they've only been at the current site since 1950; so the church building is not "century-old."


Edited by Doohickie, 08 January 2017 - 11:06 PM.


#90 Woods-Racer

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Posted 09 January 2017 - 09:26 AM

So.... like....our church got vandalized Saturday night/Sunday morning.  :(
 


There is a slight factual error though. The congregation is 130 years old, but they've only been at the current site since 1950; so the church building is not "century-old."

 

Sorry to hear Doohickie, glad no one was hurt and what was damaged is replaceable. 

 

Happy (belated) Epiphany otherwise.



#91 Doohickie

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Posted 09 January 2017 - 10:00 AM

Happy (belated) Epiphany otherwise.

 

You mean Happy Time To Take the Tree Down.  ;)



#92 Sabres Fan In NS

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Posted 09 January 2017 - 11:23 AM

So.... like....our church got vandalized Saturday night/Sunday morning.  :(
 


There is a slight factual error though. The congregation is 130 years old, but they've only been at the current site since 1950; so the church building is not "century-old."

 

That is horrible.  Sorry to hear about that.



#93 Sabres Fan In NS

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Posted 09 January 2017 - 11:35 AM

Is that a 12 days of Christmas type thing? I was born and raised Catholic but I had some ancestors that were Russian and White Russian (Belarus) so they were likely Orthodox Christian. Don't know much about Eastern Orthodox other it's the predominant "brand" of Christianity for Greeks and Russkies though.

 

Not really a 12 days of Christmas thing.  Orthodox Christians traditionally follow the Gregorian calendar, which is slightly off the Julian calendar (the one we follow), or do I have that reversed.  Anyway, Orthodox Christmas falls on January 7th ... 12 days later that December 25th.  Orthodox Easter follows this same pattern.

 

Here is a wikipidea page for your information, although wikipedia is not always your friend.  This one seems pretty good, although I only skimmed it.

 

http://en.wikipedia....Orthodox_Church

 

Basically the western church in Rome and the eastern church in Constantinople (although, I prefer Istanbul ...  ;) ) split around the year 1,000, for a number of reasons, but primarily concerning the authority of the Pope in Rome.



#94 Drunkard

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Posted 09 January 2017 - 12:03 PM

Not really a 12 days of Christmas thing.  Orthodox Christians traditionally follow the Gregorian calendar, which is slightly off the Julian calendar (the one we follow), or do I have that reversed.  Anyway, Orthodox Christmas falls on January 7th ... 12 days later that December 25th.  Orthodox Easter follows this same pattern.

 

Here is a wikipidea page for your information, although wikipedia is not always your friend.  This one seems pretty good, although I only skimmed it.

 

http://en.wikipedia....Orthodox_Church

 

Basically the western church in Rome and the eastern church in Constantinople (although, I prefer Istanbul ...  ;) ) split around the year 1,000, for a number of reasons, but primarily concerning the authority of the Pope in Rome.

 

Cool. I guess you learn something new everyday. Or today at least for me. Even as a non believer I sometimes find it interesting to see what principles/rules/doctrines/etc were responsible for all the various splits/sects/distinctions that make up the various religions. I remember watching some late night programs on the History channel about the Council of Nicea or whatever it was called where they decided which books were going to make up the new Testament of the Bible and which ones didn't make the cut. Then they talked a bit about the Book of Mary Magdalene and the Book of Judas and how differently the path of Christianity may have take if texts like these had been included.



#95 Doohickie

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Posted 09 January 2017 - 01:47 PM

Cool. I guess you learn something new everyday. Or today at least for me. Even as a non believer I sometimes find it interesting to see what principles/rules/doctrines/etc were responsible for all the various splits/sects/distinctions that make up the various religions. I remember watching some late night programs on the History channel about the Council of Nicea or whatever it was called where they decided which books were going to make up the new Testament of the Bible and which ones didn't make the cut. Then they talked a bit about the Book of Mary Magdalene and the Book of Judas and how differently the path of Christianity may have take if texts like these had been included.

 

Just remember that some of those late night History Channel programs are pseudo-history (or pseudo-theology).  It's hard to know which of those ancient books were genuine and which are later forgeries.  On shows like the ones on History Channel, they often don't bother to make that distinction.  But yeah, it does pique the imagination.



#96 Drunkard

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Posted 09 January 2017 - 02:49 PM

Just remember that some of those late night History Channel programs are pseudo-history (or pseudo-theology).  It's hard to know which of those ancient books were genuine and which are later forgeries.  On shows like the ones on History Channel, they often don't bother to make that distinction.  But yeah, it does pique the imagination.

 

True but none of the books that actually made the cut were even written during the supposed lifetime of Jesus either, so I would lump them all in together anyway. To me, it's all pseudo-history because very little of it can actually be verified/documented (some of the Egyptian stuff has been cross referenced with some of their ancients text I think).



#97 MattPie

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Posted 09 January 2017 - 03:13 PM

Not really a 12 days of Christmas thing.  Orthodox Christians traditionally follow the Gregorian calendar, which is slightly off the Julian calendar (the one we follow), or do I have that reversed.  Anyway, Orthodox Christmas falls on January 7th ... 12 days later that December 25th.  Orthodox Easter follows this same pattern.

 

Here is a wikipidea page for your information, although wikipedia is not always your friend.  This one seems pretty good, although I only skimmed it.

 

http://en.wikipedia....Orthodox_Church

 

Basically the western church in Rome and the eastern church in Constantinople (although, I prefer Istanbul ...  ;) ) split around the year 1,000, for a number of reasons, but primarily concerning the authority of the Pope in Rome.

 

I find the whole Pope/Anitpope stuff (primarily in the middle ages) fascinating too.



#98 Doohickie

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Posted 09 January 2017 - 05:25 PM

True but none of the books that actually made the cut were even written during the supposed lifetime of Jesus either, so I would lump them all in together anyway. To me, it's all pseudo-history because very little of it can actually be verified/documented (some of the Egyptian stuff has been cross referenced with some of their ancients text I think).

 

Actually, pretty much all the New Testament was written after his death, even the most primitive gospel (Mark).  the preamble of Luke says it best: 

 

1 Many have undertaken to draw up an account of the things that have been fulfilledamong us, just as they were handed down to us by those who from the first were eyewitnesses and servants of the word. With this in mind, since I myself have carefully investigated everything from the beginning, I too decided to write an orderly account for you, most excellent Theophilus, so that you may know the certainty of the things you have been taught.

 

In other words, Luke is writing down the gospel as he has heard it from others, which is filtered (carefully investigated, orderly... both of these imply research and editing).  Luke was reported to be a doctor and a traveling companion of Paul, who himself didn't meet Jesus until he saw him in a vision, post-resurrection.  The Acts of the Apostles (sequel to the biography of Jesus in the gospels) talks about the founding of the early church and was also written by Luke if I recall correctly.  Luke was at least twice removed from the original apostles.



#99 Drunkard

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Posted 09 January 2017 - 05:36 PM

Actually, pretty much all the New Testament was written after his death, even the most primitive gospel (Mark). the preamble of Luke says it best:


In other words, Luke is writing down the gospel as he has heard it from others, which is filtered (carefully investigated, orderly... both of these imply research and editing). Luke was reported to be a doctor and a traveling companion of Paul, who himself didn't meet Jesus until he saw him in a vision, post-resurrection. The Acts of the Apostles (sequel to the biography of Jesus in the gospels) talks about the founding of the early church and was also written by Luke if I recall correctly. Luke was at least twice removed from the original apostles.

That's pretty much the point I was making. None of it is first hand accounts. It makes absolutely no sense that the guy is supposed to be the son of God and died for our sins and during his lifetime he had hundreds or thousands of followers that he even fed one time with a few fish and a couple loaves of bread yet apparently not even one of the ones who could write even bothered to scribble down any of the stories as they were supposedly happening. It's all friend of a friend stuff from decades later at the earliest.

Edited by Drunkard, 09 January 2017 - 05:38 PM.


#100 Sabres Fan In NS

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Posted 09 January 2017 - 05:48 PM

The first followers of Jesus (PBUH) were faithful Jews, as was he.  He never proclaimed to be God, or the Son of God.  In Judaism such thinking is blasphemous. They viewed Jesus (PBUH) as a great Messenger of God, along the lines of Moses.  Even the great Saint Paul was a practising Jew and had great difficulty in coming to grips with how to view Jesus (PBUH).  As with most messengers of God he had great powers to heal the sick ...

 

The notion of the Trinity and Son of God came pretty long after his death, with the first inclinations around the year 100, if I'm not mistaken.  By around the year 300 the Trinity was well established Christian theology, especially when the Roman Empire, such as it was at that time, adopted Christianity as it's official religion.



#101 7+6=13

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Posted 09 January 2017 - 07:43 PM

Well I'll chime in.  I'll start by saying I'm a Christian.  I'll also say that I was brought up in a Christian home and in my late teens really took a hard look at whether I was believing what I believed because it's what someone taught me or something I believed on my own accord.   Just like most things spiritual it's difficult to prove to another person - but I did have a few things happen that no one can convince me didn't happen - that brought me through a doubting phase.  I will say it's the best thing that happened to me because right or wrong, agree with me or disagree with me, believe me or not - I know what I experienced was real.

 

To those that are genuinely not sure if God exists or what to believe - I'll offer my advice.  I'll say that what I understood in my early 20's was that I was imperfect so I couldn't entirely rely on my own thoughts or personal beliefs because I'm flawed.  For example, I forget peoples names, I forget phone numbers, I sometimes lie.  There's been times when my wife and I will disagree on something and I'm absolutely positive I'm right and then I get proven wrong and I'm like - that sucks because I was positive of whatever I knew I was right about. 

 

The above is the reason why I just can't trust my own intellect to know for sure what is and isn't as it relates to God.  I'm completely willing to fully understand and remember how wrong I've been about things in the past - that allows me to not totally trust myself on something so reliant on me being absolutely right about everything in order to know for sure I'm right?  Hope that makes sense.  In other words - I can't tell another human being God is real and if you don't believe, you're wrong - The reason is I disqualify myself by being wrong about other things.

 

I'm 42 years old and I think back on when I was 22 and say to myself - what the heck where you thinking?  So what is the age in which I should totally trust that I've got everything in life mastered to the point I can tell everyone else God is real?  The fact is I can't but I can tell you if you're telling everyone that for you God isn't real - you don't know either. 

 

So here we are.  One flawed person that believes God is real 100% and another flawed person that says God is in fact not real.  Who's right?  Certainly everyone would agree one person is wrong.  Perhaps both seemingly nice intelligent people - functioning well in society - lots of friends, etc..  So which one is wrong?

 

I'll tell you what happened to me.  I asked God (half believing and half not) that if he was real to show me.  I said if you show me and it's obvious - I'll follow you the rest of my life.  He did and I do.  But that's not for you - that was for me.  I would just encourage anyone to not get so solidified on the belief God doesn't exist because there's an important thing to remember.  Even if you don't believe in God - he wouldn't need you to believe in him to be real.  As nothing that's actually true does.  

 

Hope I didn't offend anyone.

 

 

 

 

 

 



#102 Doohickie

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Posted 09 January 2017 - 08:25 PM

I'll tell you what happened to me.  I asked God (half believing and half not) that if he was real to show me.  I said if you show me and it's obvious - I'll follow you the rest of my life.  He did and I do.  But that's not for you - that was for me.  I would just encourage anyone to not get so solidified on the belief God doesn't exist because there's an important thing to remember.  Even if you don't believe in God - he wouldn't need you to believe in him to be real.  As nothing that's actually true does. 

 

Yeah, I could recount something similar.  I was heavily leaning toward atheism (and occasionally I still do), but I've had a couple of experiences that are hard for me to explain without God.  Like you, I wouldn't expect that to convince anyone else that God exists, but it's good enough for me.



#103 Woods-Racer

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Posted 10 January 2017 - 09:43 AM

The first followers of Jesus (PBUH) were faithful Jews, as was he. He never proclaimed to be God, or the Son of God. In Judaism such thinking is blasphemous. They viewed Jesus (PBUH) as a great Messenger of God, along the lines of Moses. Even the great Saint Paul was a practising Jew and had great difficulty in coming to grips with how to view Jesus (PBUH). As with most messengers of God he had great powers to heal the sick ...

The notion of the Trinity and Son of God came pretty long after his death, with the first inclinations around the year 100, if I'm not mistaken. By around the year 300 the Trinity was well established Christian theology, especially when the Roman Empire, such as it was at that time, adopted Christianity as it's official religion.


Paper, ink, those learned enough to write, where in very short supply. Its no surprise it took a few generations for it to be written.

The only other people of the time to leave a legacy where the extremely rich, warriors, kings/queens. A *peasant* with followers that where peasants had no means to record events other than by the tradition method of verbal communication.

No one that wrote of Billy the Kid knew him first hand and rode with him. Yet everyone believes he existed.

And this little thing called faith has a lot to do with it.

#104 Drunkard

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Posted 10 January 2017 - 10:01 AM

Paper, ink, those learned enough to write, where in very short supply. Its no surprise it took a few generations for it to be written.

The only other people of the time to leave a legacy where the extremely rich, warriors, kings/queens. A *peasant* with followers that where peasants had no means to record events other than by the tradition method of verbal communication.

No one that wrote of Billy the Kid knew him first hand and rode with him. Yet everyone believes he existed.

And this little thing called faith has a lot to do with it.

 

The fact that nobody claims Billy the Kid performed miracles, died for our sins, and collects tax free donations in the billions or trillions to this day may have something to do with it as well. Motives play a HUGE part in the skeptism, not to mention the outlandish claims and the biggest reason for the skepticism (for me anyway) is that nobody is trying to sell an invisible product (salvation after you die) in the name of Billy the Kid. Other than that though, great example.



#105 bunomatic

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Posted 10 January 2017 - 10:21 AM

The fact that nobody claims Billy the Kid performed miracles, died for our sins, and collects tax free donations in the billions or trillions to this day may have something to do with it as well. Motives play a HUGE part in the skeptism, not to mention the outlandish claims and the biggest reason for the skepticism (for me anyway) is that nobody is trying to sell an invisible product (salvation after you die) in the name of Billy the Kid. Other than that though, great example.

Billie was Gods kid



#106 Drunkard

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Posted 10 January 2017 - 10:29 AM

Billie was Gods kid

 

And so are you. And so am I! Life is beautiful! Pass the collection plate.



#107 Sabres Fan In NS

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Posted 10 January 2017 - 01:13 PM

Paper, ink, those learned enough to write, where in very short supply. Its no surprise it took a few generations for it to be written.

The only other people of the time to leave a legacy where the extremely rich, warriors, kings/queens. A *peasant* with followers that where peasants had no means to record events other than by the tradition method of verbal communication.

No one that wrote of Billy the Kid knew him first hand and rode with him. Yet everyone believes he existed.

And this little thing called faith has a lot to do with it.

 

I certainly meant no offence, so I hope you, or anyone else, did not take any.

 

I hear you.

 

-----

 

For any inclined to read up on the history of God and the various religions I very highly recommend ... 'A History of God' by Karen Armstrong.

 

http://en.wikipedia...._History_of_God



#108 7+6=13

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Posted 10 January 2017 - 02:37 PM

And so are you. And so am I! Life is beautiful! Pass the collection plate.

 

Or charge admission which would you prefer? 

 

Wouldn't it be great if you could go to a restaurant and pay whatever you want for the meal?



#109 Drunkard

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Posted 11 January 2017 - 09:15 AM

Or charge admission which would you prefer? 

 

Wouldn't it be great if you could go to a restaurant and pay whatever you want for the meal?

 

At least you get a meal out of that restaurant for your money. What do you get from the church? The promise of eternal afterlife that they can't prove until after you're already dead and it's too late to get your time or money back? It's like if I went into business selling imaginary widgets only I never have to make them or deliver them and I get paid up front but I promise I'll deliver after you die. Hell of a business model they have. It's like selling life insurance without ever having to make the payment to the beneficiary.



#110 Drunkard

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Posted 11 January 2017 - 10:56 AM

9519167_orig.jpg

 

I honestly don't even know what to make of this quote. Seems like a meaningless platitude that doesn't really say anything like "everything happens for a reason" or "the lord works in mysterious ways". If you find meaning in it, more power to you though.



#111 MattPie

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Posted 11 January 2017 - 11:36 AM

That's pretty much the point I was making. None of it is first hand accounts. It makes absolutely no sense that the guy is supposed to be the son of God and died for our sins and during his lifetime he had hundreds or thousands of followers that he even fed one time with a few fish and a couple loaves of bread yet apparently not even one of the ones who could write even bothered to scribble down any of the stories as they were supposedly happening. It's all friend of a friend stuff from decades later at the earliest.

 

The peasant angle above is a good one. Another is I'd guess for awhile Christian writings were considered pretty subversive and would therefore be kept hidden, and likely lost when the owners disappeared in one way or another.

 

Let's start with an easy one, Drunkard.

 

Where does the Sun come from?

 

The sun is a mass of incandescent gas; a gigantic nuclear furnace. Where hydrogen is fused into helium at a temperature of millions of degrees.

 

I think science has a pretty good idea about the sun that doesn't require divine intervention. Now, if you wanted to discuss how matter ended up packed all together just before the big bang, I'd accept there could be forces at work there.



#112 Randall Flagg

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Posted 11 January 2017 - 11:48 AM

Let's start with an easy one, Drunkard.

 

Where does the Sun come from?

To save some time, the laws of physics will take us back right to the origin of the universe, and then the final question is a big "I don't know" to every single human being, though millions of different answers to suit each person's belief, lack thereof, and everything in between will be given in its place.



#113 Drunkard

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Posted 11 January 2017 - 11:54 AM

Let's start with an easy one, Drunkard.

 

Where does the Sun come from?

 

The same place the trillions of other stars came from. Our particular star isn't really anything more special than the others other than it allows our planet to support life. I'm not a physicist but pretty much all matter materialized from the big bang and the Higgs Boson allowed for pure massless energy to slow down from the speed of light and "achieve" (probably not the right term but I went to school for business so it'll have to do) mass and a solid state within the universe. Our sun acquired mass through the Higgs field, along with the planets and moons, and everything else that has a physical mass.


To save some time, the laws of physics will take us back right to the origin of the universe, and then the final question is a big "I don't know" to every single human being, though millions of different answers to suit each person's belief, lack thereof, and everything in between will be given in its place.

 

Science is hard and complicated. Let's just say God did it and get on with our day.


Edited by Drunkard, 11 January 2017 - 11:55 AM.


#114 Sabres Fan In NS

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Posted 11 January 2017 - 12:00 PM

Since this is the religion thread I would like to add this ...

 

http://www.islam-guide.com/ch1-1-c.htm

 

The above link is very basic, but I choose it for the simplicity of it.

 

The Qur'an makes it very clear how the universe began.  Basically, God created the primordial matter and then brought it together and then exploded it out.



#115 Randall Flagg

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Posted 11 January 2017 - 12:13 PM

I thought you were an atheist.

 

Or are you a Higgs worshiper?

What does this mean?



#116 Drunkard

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Posted 11 January 2017 - 12:29 PM

I thought you were an atheist.

 

Or are you a Higgs worshiper?

 

I am an atheist. I don't worship Higgs but it's the consensus in the scientific community. I don't worship gravity either but I still believe in it.



#117 Sabres Fan In NS

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Posted 11 January 2017 - 12:30 PM

What does this mean?

 

Peter, as opposed to the even more famous Peter, as in Simon.



#118 Drunkard

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Posted 11 January 2017 - 12:43 PM

What does this mean?

 

It's nonsense. He's trying to equate belief in science with belief in an imaginary man (yep, he's definitely a dude) living in the sky who somehow was never created himself and has always existed and he also managed to create everything else. Despite all that power, greatness, omnipotence, and grandeur this God figure is a jealous being that punishes people that are bad and/or refuse to worship him, even though we were created in his image. To top it all off he loves you. Oh, and he needs your money.



#119 Jon in Pasadena

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Posted 11 January 2017 - 01:53 PM

It's nonsense. He's trying to equate belief in science with belief in an imaginary man (yep, he's definitely a dude) living in the sky who somehow was never created himself and has always existed and he also managed to create everything else. Despite all that power, greatness, omnipotence, and grandeur this God figure is a jealous being that punishes people that are bad and/or refuse to worship him, even though we were created in his image. To top it all off he loves you. Oh, and he needs your money.

I think somebody's a George Carlin fan... ;)



#120 Drunkard

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Posted 11 January 2017 - 03:54 PM

I think somebody's a George Carlin fan... ;)

 

Yes, sir. I was already an atheist by the point (1999 I think), but if I hadn't been that bit may have been enough to push me over the edge. So colorful and succinct at the same time. The Zeitgeist documentary even used that bit in their movie, although they added a cartoon to it as well. Awesome stuff. 







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