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Sabres Prospects 2016-17


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#521 Taro T

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Posted 15 July 2017 - 08:38 PM

Since when is a 6'1 player considered small?
I don't think anyone is really "worried" about Nylander. Disappointed a little that he wasn't more dominant in the A, even at 18. However 28 pts in 65 games is .40 p/gp isn't horrible for a 18 year old in the AHL. It was certainly better the Zemgus did in similar circumstances a few years ago when he had 17 pts in 61 games for the Amerks.
Where the disappontment comes in was in comparing him to his brother. William was the 8th pick in 2014. In the season following his draft, he split time between the SHL (20 pts in 21 games) and the AHL (32 pts in 37 games).


William did do better his 1st year in the A, but he actually got to play on a AHL team, not the tire fire the Amerks were.

Hopefully passing on Chychrun/Sergachev works out.

#522 GASabresFan

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Posted 15 July 2017 - 08:45 PM

William did do better his 1st year in the A, but he actually got to play on a AHL team, not the tire fire the Amerks were.
Hopefully passing on Chychrun/Sergachev works out.

The Marlies were good that season, but Connor Brown was their best other player that year. Had he not also put up 20 pts in 21 games in the SHL I might be more willing to buy the better team excuse for the huge difference in their AHL performance.

Edited by GASabresFan, 15 July 2017 - 08:45 PM.


#523 Thorny

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Posted 16 July 2017 - 12:45 AM

The Marlies were good that season, but Connor Brown was their best other player that year. Had he not also put up 20 pts in 21 games in the SHL I might be more willing to buy the better team excuse for the huge difference in their AHL performance.


Well, maybe he played on a good team over there in the SHL, too. Sorry, too lazy to look that up right now.

#524 TrueBlueGED

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Posted 16 July 2017 - 09:51 AM

Well, maybe he played on a good team over there in the SHL, too. Sorry, too lazy to look that up right now.


I don't even think good/bad team is all that important here. For me, the key is William Nylander spent two years playing against men in the SHL before going to the AHL. Alex had 1 year in junior.

It's certainly possible (maybe even likely) that William is the better hockey player, but their development paths have essentially nothing in common, so I'm hesitant to hold their first AHL seasons to too strict of a comparison.

#525 nfreeman

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Posted 16 July 2017 - 10:27 AM

The meteoric rise of Nikita Kucherov in the player ranking thread got me thinking about player development and Alex Nylander.

In his post draft year Kucherov put up 1/3/4 in 18 games in the KHL
He then came over here and spent a year tearing up the Q
After that he dominated the AHL early and was promoted to the NHL where he potted 18 points in 58 games as a rookie.

In other words, Kucherov struggled more than Alex did as an 18-year-old in a men's league. And he was a year year older than Alex is now when he made the NHL and he didn't exactly rip it up in that year.

I guess what I'm saying is it might be premature to start worrying about Nylander. He's a small skilled player who just turned 19.

Since when is a 6'1 player considered small?

I don't think anyone is really "worried" about Nylander. Disappointed a little that he wasn't more dominant in the A, even at 18. However 28 pts in 65 games is .40 p/gp isn't horrible for a 18 year old in the AHL. It was certainly better the Zemgus did in similar circumstances a few years ago when he had 17 pts in 61 games for the Amerks.

Where the disappontment comes in was in comparing him to his brother. William was the 8th pick in 2014. In the season following his draft, he split time between the SHL (20 pts in 21 games) and the AHL (32 pts in 37 games).

William did do better his 1st year in the A, but he actually got to play on a AHL team, not the tire fire the Amerks were.

Hopefully passing on Chychrun/Sergachev works out.

The Marlies were good that season, but Connor Brown was their best other player that year. Had he not also put up 20 pts in 21 games in the SHL I might be more willing to buy the better team excuse for the huge difference in their AHL performance.

I don't even think good/bad team is all that important here. For me, the key is William Nylander spent two years playing against men in the SHL before going to the AHL. Alex had 1 year in junior.

It's certainly possible (maybe even likely) that William is the better hockey player, but their development paths have essentially nothing in common, so I'm hesitant to hold their first AHL seasons to too strict of a comparison.

 

 

Good hockey talk here boys.



#526 Randall Flagg

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Posted 16 July 2017 - 11:14 AM

I think the chance Alex becomes the player William already was during his rookie year is slim. William is already a very, very good NHLer, and is likely going to be a star.

#527 dudacek

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Posted 16 July 2017 - 11:30 AM

I think the chance Alex becomes the player William already was during his rookie year is slim. William is already a very, very good NHLer, and is likely going to be a star.


A Leaf fan told me he was among the ten best players in the NHL.
Only the third best player on TO though.

#528 North Buffalo

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Posted 16 July 2017 - 11:40 AM

A Leaf fan told me he was among the ten best players in the NHL.
Only the third best player on TO though.

Leave fans have a little grandiose sense of their team. If 3 top ten players, why didnt they win the whole thing. I piss on leaves..
I could name 20 better players then Nylander, hes good but not in top 20, other than Matthews, who else there cracks the top 50?

#529 Taro T

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Posted 16 July 2017 - 12:01 PM

Leave fans have a little grandiose sense of their team. If 3 top ten players, why didnt they win the whole thing. I piss on leaves..I could name 20 better players then Nylander, hes good but not in top 20, other than Matthews, who else there cracks the top 50?


My guess is that Loaf fan ranks Marner higher.

#530 North Buffalo

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Posted 16 July 2017 - 12:04 PM

Hell Marner isnt even top 20, look at our ranking board. I have my top 75 Marner nor Nylander anywhere in sight... lol.

#531 Randall Flagg

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Posted 16 July 2017 - 12:13 PM

Looking at the list I made, they have Matthews (27), Marner (56), Nylander (79), Kadri (85), JVR (146), Rielly (153), Gardiner (159), and Bozak (199) in my top 200


Edited by Randall Flagg, 16 July 2017 - 12:15 PM.


#532 Taro T

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Posted 16 July 2017 - 12:22 PM

Hell Marner isnt even top 20, look at our ranking board. I have my top 75 Marner nor Nylander anywhere in sight... lol.


Never said he was. But that's the guess as to who Loaf fanboi was referring. ;)

#533 dudacek

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Posted 16 July 2017 - 12:58 PM

Never said he was. But that's the guess as to who Loaf fanboi was referring. ;)


Yep.

#534 North Buffalo

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Posted 16 July 2017 - 01:58 PM

Looking at the list I made, they have Matthews (27), Marner (56), Nylander (79), Kadri (85), JVR (146), Rielly (153), Gardiner (159), and Bozak (199) in my top 200

Interesting, I have Kadri in front of both at 60ish followed by Marner and and Nylander both closely now in the low 80s. I do think Nylander will be much better in time imo.

#535 Thorny

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Posted 16 July 2017 - 05:53 PM

I think the chance Alex becomes the player William already was during his rookie year is slim. William is already a very, very good NHLer, and is likely going to be a star.


I wouldn't say that, I can definitely see the possibility of Alex becoming a 60 point player on a scoring line here. It's by no means guaranteed, but I wouldn't say the likelihood is slim.

#536 GASabresFan

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Posted 16 July 2017 - 07:12 PM

While we Sabres Fans are occasionally delusional, Leafs fans have to be the biggest group of delusional fans in the NHL.

 

Lets review,  In my lifetime (and since their last Cup win in 1967) the Leafs have won

1 divisional title (1999-2000)

0 Conference Championships

0 Stanley Cups

0 Presidents' Trophy

3 Appearances in the Conference Finals  (all loses)

Missed the playoffs 17 since the Sabres joined the NHL

Highest Cost per ticket in the NHL

 

Buffalo Sabres

6 Division Championships

2 Conference Championships

0 Stanley Cups

1 Presidents' Trophy

5 Appearances in Conference Finals (record 2-3)

Missed the playoffs 17 times (but 3 in first 4 years)

17th in average ticket cost

 

 

Which history would you rather have?

 

I was thinking about our D camp and the prospects that played in it.  We actually had prospects from 3 different GM's

Regier: Peterson, Florentino, Malone, Baptiste, Hurley, and Bailey

Murray: Fasching, Brown, Willman, Martin, Johansson, Karabacek, Cornel, Stephens, Borgen, Guhle, Nylander, Asplund, Fitzgerald, Murray, Budik. Hagel, Osmanski and Glotov

Botterill: Mittelstadt, Davidsson, Luukkonen, Laaksonen, Bryson and Weissbach

 

One other note: 2017 was the first draft in Sabres history that not a single players from a CHL team was drafted.  No kids from the OHL, QMJHL or the WHL.  Instead we 2 two kids from the USHL, one from the NCAA and 3 from Scandinavia.


Edited by GASabresFan, 16 July 2017 - 07:59 PM.


#537 MattPie

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Posted 18 July 2017 - 02:14 PM

Since when is a 6'1 player considered small?

I don't think anyone is really "worried" about Nylander. Disappointed a little that he wasn't more dominant in the A, even at 18. However 28 pts in 65 games is .40 p/gp isn't horrible for a 18 year old in the AHL. It was certainly better the Zemgus did in similar circumstances a few years ago when he had 17 pts in 61 games for the Amerks.

Where the disappontment comes in was in comparing him to his brother. William was the 8th pick in 2014. In the season following his draft, he split time between the SHL (20 pts in 21 games) and the AHL (32 pts in 37 games).

 

As much as I want to like Zemgus, using him as the bar is only borderline NHL player at this point.



#538 inkman

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Posted 18 July 2017 - 03:45 PM

Since when is a 6'1 player considered small?


When that height is accompanied with a 160 lbs body soaking wet.

Edited by inkman, 18 July 2017 - 03:45 PM.


#539 kas23

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Posted 18 July 2017 - 05:02 PM

When that height is accompanied with a 160 lbs body soaking wet.


Players can bulk up, but they can't grow taller.

#540 North Buffalo

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Posted 18 July 2017 - 05:16 PM

at eighteen thats what i was, now 6'1 - 200 gotta lose abt 15 lbs myself, I'll give it to him :)

#541 ShadowLiger

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Posted 18 July 2017 - 05:20 PM

Players can bulk up, but they can't grow taller.

I was 5'11" at 18, by 21 I was 6'1"
That said Nylander will bulk up

#542 inkman

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Posted 18 July 2017 - 06:38 PM

I was 5'11" at 18, by 21 I was 6'1"
That said Nylander will bulk up

He should but wow was dude slight last season. He looked half the size of most of the players.

#543 North Buffalo

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Posted 18 July 2017 - 06:45 PM

He should but wow was dude slight last season. He looked half the size of most of the players.

He played a lot of hockey, at his age I had to fight to keep weight on. One at 20 years of age working as a bike messenger, I dropped to 137lbs eating 5 meals a day plus a pint of ice cream. Once it cooled down I jumped back up to 165 as I didnt work as much while in school. Its understandable, dude needs to eat an American growth hormone filled burger a nite.

#544 Taro T

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Posted 18 July 2017 - 07:09 PM

He played a lot of hockey, at his age I had to fight to keep weight on. One at 20 years of age working as a bike messenger, I dropped to 137lbs eating 5 meals a day plus a pint of ice cream. Once it cooled down I jumped back up to 165 as I didnt work as much while in school. Its understandable, dude needs to eat an American growth hormone filled burger a nite.


Yeah, just what they need, another player w/ a fat head. ;)

#545 inkman

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Posted 18 July 2017 - 07:31 PM

He played a lot of hockey, at his age I had to fight to keep weight on. One at 20 years of age working as a bike messenger, I dropped to 137lbs eating 5 meals a day plus a pint of ice cream. Once it cooled down I jumped back up to 165 as I didnt work as much while in school. Its understandable, dude needs to eat an American growth hormone filled burger a nite.


I'm certaintly not advocating he can't do it. I was a buck 35 when I graduated high school and left college at 195 so I understand the plight. Hopefully he'll put it on a little more healthy than I did.

#546 North Buffalo

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Posted 19 July 2017 - 04:52 AM

I'm certaintly not advocating he can't do it. I was a buck 35 when I graduated high school and left college at 195 so I understand the plight. Hopefully he'll put it on a little more healthy than I did.


Lol, that I can understand, didnt drink when I was a courier, that would have been torture in the morning... still looked like a Heroin addict.

#547 BRAWNDO

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Posted 20 July 2017 - 08:09 PM

Interesting look at the future.

http://www.thehockey...-in-three-years

I would add Mittlestadt to the list

#548 Thorny

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Posted 20 July 2017 - 08:15 PM

4 years is a "perpetual rebuild"?

#549 Randall Flagg

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Posted 20 July 2017 - 08:15 PM

I think that's a horrible and lazy prediction.

 

CJ Smith is not good. 



#550 Sabres79

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Posted 20 July 2017 - 08:26 PM

That whole left side is not good. 



#551 ShadowLiger

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Posted 20 July 2017 - 08:29 PM

That whole left side is not good.

Meh, wingers can be found.

#552 Sabres79

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Posted 20 July 2017 - 08:30 PM

Meh, wingers can be found.

Let's all hope so. 



#553 Thorny

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Posted 20 July 2017 - 08:33 PM

That whole left side is not good.


Kane may be there, too.

#554 ShadowLiger

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Posted 20 July 2017 - 08:33 PM

Let's all hope so.

Mittlestadt, Olofsson, Pu, Davidsson all could be left wings.

#555 Sabres79

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Posted 20 July 2017 - 08:36 PM

Kane may be there, too.

 

 

Mittlestadt, Olofsson, Pu, Davidsson all could be left wings.

 

I don't doubt that it can / will actually be better in reality than the lineup posited in the article.  That lineup though, is hot garbage. 



#556 ShadowLiger

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Posted 20 July 2017 - 08:36 PM

I don't doubt that it can / will actually be better in reality than the lineup posited in the article. That lineup though, is hot garbage.

Oh yea that lineup sucks. Also I think Nylander plays the off wing.

Edited by ShadowLiger, 20 July 2017 - 08:37 PM.


#557 Thorny

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Posted 20 July 2017 - 08:41 PM

I don't doubt that it can / will actually be better in reality than the lineup posited in the article. That lineup though, is hot garbage.


I don't think so. Not if you allow for the reasoning behind the projections in the article to be true, as well. That lineup would have an elite centre spine, a good RW, and a Pu that has, from the projection in the article/proposed lineup, developed into a good player, on the LW.

D looks pretty good, too (aside from Bogo).

The inclusion of Smith is an odd one, I'll give you that. But switch him with Mittelstadt, and it's looking pretty good. And also pretty close to what we should expect, to be honest. Plus minus a Kane.

Edited by Thorny, 20 July 2017 - 08:43 PM.


#558 Sabres79

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Posted 20 July 2017 - 08:49 PM

I don't think so. Not if you allow for the reasoning behind the projections in the article to be true, as well. That lineup would have an elite centre spine, a good RW, and a Pu that has, from the projection in the article/proposed lineup, developed into a good player, on the LW.

D looks pretty good, too (aside from Bogo).

The inclusion of Smith is an odd one, I'll give you that. But switch him with Mittelstadt, and it's looking pretty good. And also pretty close to what we should expect, to be honest. Plus minus a Kane.

And a Pu, Larsson, and Zemgus.  Just no.



#559 Thorny

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Posted 20 July 2017 - 08:51 PM

Oh yea that lineup sucks. Also I think Nylander plays the off wing.

If that lineup "sucks", we are in for a world of hurt. There's a decent chance the only difference is Mittelstadt:

Mittelstadt - Eichel - Nylander
Pu - O'Reilly - Okposo
Larsson - Reinhart - Bailey
Girgensons - Asplund - Fasching

Scandella - Ristolainen
Guhle - Beaulieu
McCabe - Bogosian

Ullmark
Johansson

...looks fine to me.

And a Pu, Larsson, and Zemgus.  Just no.


In the context of the article, Pu develops into a contributing winger. Certainly not out of the realm of possibility. Sub in Baptiste if you want, but I don't think Pu is a less likely candidate to succeed here.

Edited by Thorny, 20 July 2017 - 08:49 PM.


#560 FuhrFury

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Posted 20 July 2017 - 08:59 PM

I think the Sabres are actually 2-4 in Conference Finals (1975, 1980, 1998, 1999, 2006, 2007).

 

 

 

5 Appearances in Conference Finals (record 2-3)

 

 

 

That article doesn't include Mittelstadt, Kane, Baptiste, and Davidsson. Here are my top 12 forwards in a few years:

 

Mittelstadt - Eichel - Nylander

Kane - Reinhart - Okposo

Asplund - O'Reilly - Baptiste

Davidsson - Girgensons - Bailey

 

That looks incredibly strong to me. Possibly the best in the entire league if all 12 reach their talent projections? Or am I being a homer?