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NHL to Implement Coaches Challenge Replay System


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Poll: Do you want a replay system in the NHL?

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Do you want a coaches challenge replay system in the NHL?

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#1 26CornerBlitz

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 11:59 AM

@TSNBobMcKenzie

Quote

If all goes as planned with NHL Competition Committee (today)/NHL GMs (Wed), Coach's Challenge is likely to be instituted next year, but...

...But, at this point, subject to change, goalie interference calls would NOT be amongst criteria a coach could challenge via video review.

Until Comp Committee and GMs beat this up, nothing is in final form but limited and very specific Coach's Challenge appears to be the plan.

Overdue or Slippery Slope?

#2 MattPie

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 12:13 PM

It'll be interesting to see what reviewable and what isn't. Reviews in the NFL make a lot of sense since the game is much more beholden to measurement and boundaries (were his feet in, did the ball cross this line, etc.). The NHL has far fewer of these situations, and most aren't "that" important. The only one that really matters is the goal line, and that's already covered. The only other one I could really think of is if an off-sides directly leads to a goal.

#3 X. Benedict

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 12:20 PM

I don't want to see coaches have any direct roll in the outcome of games other than who they send over the boards.

#4 Tankalicious

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 12:23 PM

View PostX. Benedict, on 09 June 2014 - 12:20 PM, said:

I don't want to see coaches have any direct roll in the outcome of games other than who they send over the boards.

Unless it's Ron Rolston. He's not allowed to do that even... Probably for good reason.

As for me, I'm glad they'll be bringing it in. BUT make sure it's quick. Put a time limit on these things and don't waste everybody's time by hiding behind inconclusive evidence on every call. Make the call that you see.

#5 TrueBluePhD

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 12:37 PM

Long overdue. If you're really worried about the flow of the game, just send it to commercial whenever there's a review.

#6 Eleven

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 12:40 PM

View PostMattPie, on 09 June 2014 - 12:13 PM, said:

It'll be interesting to see what reviewable and what isn't. Reviews in the NFL make a lot of sense since the game is much more beholden to measurement and boundaries (were his feet in, did the ball cross this line, etc.). The NHL has far fewer of these situations, and most aren't "that" important. The only one that really matters is the goal line, and that's already covered. The only other one I could really think of is if an off-sides directly leads to a goal.

I think everyone in Buffalo can think of one more, although it's not a rule anymore.

#7 Taro T

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 12:59 PM

View PostEleven, on 09 June 2014 - 12:40 PM, said:

I think everyone in Buffalo can think of one more, although it's not a rule anymore.
Yeah, but theoretically all potential goals are now reviewed so there's NO WAY a puck shot into the goal through the netting would count. ;)

Oh, that's not the one you meant?  Then surely you must mean either a blatently blown icing call resulting in an OT goal or a player being in the crease AND deflecting a puck into the net with a high stick which the ref refused to have reviewed.

Oh, those aren't the one you meant either?  No idea what you could possibly be referring to.  :angel:

Not bad.  For 3 consecutive years, in the round the Sabres were eliminated, there was a call against them so egregious that the league changed a rule for the next season.  :censored:

Edited by Taro T, 09 June 2014 - 01:00 PM.


#8 Spndnchz

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 01:18 PM

How many do they get? What do they lose, their one time out?

#9 d4rksabre

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 01:18 PM

I like it.

#10 wjag

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 01:26 PM

Not sure hockey has the same black and white considerations outside of the goal.  And that is already reveiwed.  Maybe did the puck go out untouched?  Did the player touch it, so no icing?  I'm okay with reviewing did it go out, but I would think camera angles will be bad.

#11 26CornerBlitz

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 01:29 PM

View Postwjag, on 09 June 2014 - 01:26 PM, said:

Not sure hockey has the same black and white considerations outside of the goal.  And that is already reveiwed.  Maybe did the puck go out untouched?  Did the player touch it, so no icing?  I'm okay with reviewing did it go out, but I would think camera angles will be bad.

I've seen lots of bad offside calls that led directly to goals.  Hope technology that definitively indicates a puck crossing the goal line comes to fruition some day.

#12 PASabreFan

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 01:32 PM

Whatever they do, they have to start communicating 1,000% better with the fans in the building and watching on TV. Yeah, I'm sure they'll get that part of it right. It's currently a joke.

#13 Sabres Fan In NS

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 01:48 PM

I'm with X on this one.

I don't like it.  Let the players on the ice decide the game.

If you recall, I am about the only football fan that hates the goal line crap FIFA is doing.

#14 Tankalicious

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 01:52 PM

View PostSabres Fan In NS, on 09 June 2014 - 01:48 PM, said:

I'm with X on this one.

I don't like it.  Let the players on the ice decide the game.

If you recall, I am about the only football fan that hates the goal line crap FIFA is doing.

That's the issue. Sometimes the players don't decide the game... The refs do. Allowing replay puts the game more in control of the players.

#15 Sabres Fan In NS

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 01:57 PM

View PostTankalicious, on 09 June 2014 - 01:52 PM, said:

That's the issue. Sometimes the players don't decide the game... The refs do. Allowing replay puts the game more in control of the players.

No disrespect, but no it doesn't.  It puts too much control on a coach.

I rather keep the goal review by the league and let the refs manage the game ... well, or poorly, it does not matter to me.

I do not want a coach to be able to dispute a call by a ref.  The refing, good, or bad, is part of the game.

#16 26CornerBlitz

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 02:03 PM

View PostSabres Fan In NS, on 09 June 2014 - 01:57 PM, said:

No disrespect, but no it doesn't.  It puts too much control on a coach.

I rather keep the goal review by the league and let the refs manage the game ... well, or poorly, it does not matter to me.

I do not want a coach to be able to dispute a call by a ref.  The refing, good, or bad, is part of the game.

Linesmen miss an offside call that causes the Sabres to lose game 7 of the SCF.  You'd be okay with that?

#17 Campy

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 02:03 PM

View PostX. Benedict, on 09 June 2014 - 12:20 PM, said:

I don't want to see coaches have any direct roll in the outcome of games other than who they send over the boards.

Agreed.

I just don't think hockey is a sport that lends itself to replays - it seems sports with intermittent action like football and baseball are better-suited to have a replay system.

#18 Tankalicious

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 02:03 PM

View PostSabres Fan In NS, on 09 June 2014 - 01:57 PM, said:



No disrespect, but no it doesn't.  It puts too much control on a coach.

I rather keep the goal review by the league and let the refs manage the game ... well, or poorly, it does not matter to me.

I do not want a coach to be able to dispute a call by a ref.  The refing, good, or bad, is part of the game.

I'm not saying reffing isn't part of the game. I'm saying that replay doesn't actually take control away from the players. It gives them more. The players make the plays, and refs sometimes miss those plays. The coaches can only challenge what the players already did/didn't do.

If limited it gives coaches only a little more control than they already have.

#19 IKnowPhysics

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 02:04 PM

There area calls that are black and white and video review can eliminate human error.  There are also calls that are not only judgement calls, but part of a larger system of balancing calls and game management internal to the refs during a game that should not be interfered with.

I'd need to see the details before judging a video review system.

#20 X. Benedict

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 02:09 PM

View Post26CornerBlitz, on 09 June 2014 - 02:03 PM, said:

Linesmen miss an offside call that causes the Sabres to lose game 7 of the SCF.  You'd be okay with that?

I'd hate it. But I'd prefer that to stoppages with video replays.

Before the 2005 lockout many games were beginning to creep up to 3 hours. The perfect game should be no longer than 2 hours 15 minutes.

Edited by X. Benedict, 09 June 2014 - 02:10 PM.


#21 Sabres Fan In NS

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 02:51 PM

View Post26CornerBlitz, on 09 June 2014 - 02:03 PM, said:

Linesmen miss an offside call that causes the Sabres to lose game 7 of the SCF.  You'd be okay with that?

Yes.

I wouldn't like it, but I would be OK with it.

We could just as easily win the cup on a missed offside call.  Would you be OK with that?


:P

You don't have to answer.

#22 Eleven

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 02:52 PM

View PostSabres Fan In NS, on 09 June 2014 - 02:51 PM, said:

Yes.

I wouldn't like it, but I would be OK with it.

We could just as easily win the cup on a missed offside call.  Would you be OK with that?


:P

You don't have to answer.

I don't want an asterisk.

#23 Sabres Fan In NS

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 02:54 PM

View PostEleven, on 09 June 2014 - 02:52 PM, said:

I don't want an asterisk.

Is that actually engraved on the cup ever?

#24 26CornerBlitz

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 02:59 PM

View PostSabres Fan In NS, on 09 June 2014 - 02:51 PM, said:

Yes.

I wouldn't like it, but I would be OK with it.

We could just as easily win the cup on a missed offside call.  Would you be OK with that?


:P

You don't have to answer.

Truthfully, I'd detest either scenario.  If there's an ability to get the call right, do it.

#25 Eleven

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 03:03 PM

View PostSabres Fan In NS, on 09 June 2014 - 02:54 PM, said:

Is that actually engraved on the cup ever?

I am going to sneak into the HHOF and engrave one for 1999.

#26 PASabreFan

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 03:28 PM

View PostEleven, on 09 June 2014 - 03:03 PM, said:

I am going to sneak into the HHOF and engrave one for 1999.

The Sabres' Cup, just so you know, would also have had one.

#27 Eleven

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 04:04 PM

View PostPASabreFan, on 09 June 2014 - 03:28 PM, said:

The Sabres' Cup, just so you know, would also have had one.

Why?

#28 qwksndmonster

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 04:38 PM

I like the idea of a review system, but I know the NHL is going to mess it up terribly somehow.

#29 ThirtyEight

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 05:24 PM

A team brings a puck in off-side and cycles it for 2 minutes. Finally, when fatigue sets into their opponents legs, an opening appears and they score. Goal or no goal?

Hockey is an interesting game to bring this into. I'm not against it. But it is very fast flowing

Team A brings the puck in off-side. Team B strips them of the puck and goes on an odd-man rush 2 on 1 and scores. Can team A point out the missed offside?

#30 Darryl Shannon's +/-

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 05:29 PM

Properly applied, I like the idea.  And by properly applied, I don't want it to slow down the game to see if a faceoff should be inside or outside the blue line.  I'd want it to be able to negate goals that shouldn't stand or call or reverse black and white penalty calls.  Another fun application would be too many men on the ice as well.

As for the penalty idea, I think it would only work to be able to call or nullify delay of game or point out a gross misconduct type of play.  Lucic spearing Dekeyser should be the type of thing that can be reviewed....if missed by the ref behind the play, they can consult the tape and give that 5 and a game.  But I think roughing, tripping, diving etc is impossible to properly call with this type of system.

#31 26CornerBlitz

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 06:28 PM

@FriedgeHNIC    ·

Quote

Competition Committee met for five hours today...

You can tell there is a real concern about opening video review to goaltender interference. Too much interpretation.

Coaches challenge: only if coach still has his timeout. Can't do it if don't have it. That is what is being recommended.

Could apply to pucks over glass, if goalie touches puck in trapezoid (but only if penalty called), if play was offsides, although...

It is still TBD how long after an offside occurs that a missed call is relevant
.


#32 Sabres Fan In NS

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 05:17 AM

View PostEleven, on 09 June 2014 - 03:03 PM, said:

I am going to sneak into the HHOF and engrave one for 1999.

I will help you with that.

Although, I hate the thought of having to go back to Toronto.

View PostPASabreFan, on 09 June 2014 - 03:28 PM, said:

The Sabres' Cup, just so you know, would also have had one.

Don't you mean the *Sabres' Cusp*?

#33 PASabreFan

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 05:59 AM

View PostSabres Fan In NS, on 10 June 2014 - 05:17 AM, said:

Don't you mean the *Sabres' Cusp*?

Of course. Good call.

View PostEleven, on 09 June 2014 - 04:04 PM, said:

Why?

Don't get me wrong. The two asterisks would not be the same. But don't you think, had Hull's goal been taken back and the Sabres had won the Cup, we'd still be hearing something along the lines of: *"yeah, but, you won it because a goal that would have counted for generations and would be counted for generations after was wiped out by that stupid crease rule"? (I will ask that any resident proofreader, wordsmith or doctorate in English please back me up on how to punctuate that asterisk.

Now, speaking of punctuating asterisks, it's almost 7 and the coffee is starting to work. Per-cu-la-she-own.

#34 Kristian

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 06:26 AM

Honestly, if the NHL would just be a little less inconsistent and bush-league in the way they officiate the game, and discipline it's players and coaches, this debate never takes place.

#35 shrader

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 07:23 AM

A couple scenarios come to mind right away:

1. There is no way that the goal from Detroit earlier this year where the puck hit the protective netting should be allowed to stand.  They better be able to review something like that.  It's just like the Sabres-Flyers goal from 2000 or so that Taro mentioned.

2. Reviews for the sake of penalties are a slippery slope, but I would hope they'd be able to look at something objective like sticks to the face.  How many times have we seen those go uncalled?  Then there is the rare version where it is actually a teammate's stick that makes contact yet someone still gets a penalty.  That stuff needs to go.

#36 PASabreFan

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 07:58 AM

View Postshrader, on 10 June 2014 - 07:23 AM, said:

A couple scenarios come to mind right away:

1. There is no way that the goal from Detroit earlier this year where the puck hit the protective netting should be allowed to stand.  They better be able to review something like that.  It's just like the Sabres-Flyers goal from 2000 or so that Taro mentioned.

2. Reviews for the sake of penalties are a slippery slope, but I would hope they'd be able to look at something objective like sticks to the face.  How many times have we seen those go uncalled?  Then there is the rare version where it is actually a teammate's stick that makes contact yet someone still gets a penalty.  That stuff needs to go.

It's too messy. How is a coach going to know a replay is available that shows a stick did or did not hit someone above the shoulder? Then we get into the inequity of the camera angles available in Montreal on a Saturday night vs. Florida on, uh, any night.

How many challenges is a coach going to get? I can't see wasting one for the sake of a power play.

#37 shrader

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 09:07 AM

View PostPASabreFan, on 10 June 2014 - 07:58 AM, said:

It's too messy. How is a coach going to know a replay is available that shows a stick did or did not hit someone above the shoulder? Then we get into the inequity of the camera angles available in Montreal on a Saturday night vs. Florida on, uh, any night.

Generally they know right away.  Your guy is down in the corner with blood pouring out of his face, but no call was made.  If the bench didn't see it themselves, they'll have more than enough time for someone in the press box to check it out while the player is being checked on by the trainer.

As for the camera issue, that's something I'm sure I've mentioned plenty of times over the years.  They need to standardize the camera shots available at each arena.  Even the NFL doesn't seem to get that one right, but if you want to have a serious replay system, the same shots need to be available everywhere.  There are some obvious limitations given the layout of certain buildings, but I do think they've improved in this area a bit.

View PostPASabreFan, on 10 June 2014 - 07:58 AM, said:

How many challenges is a coach going to get? I can't see wasting one for the sake of a power play.

Just like in the NFL, it's situational.  Depending on the limit, if you're deep in the 3rd period and have the option of a challenge, you're going to make that call.

#38 X. Benedict

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 11:12 AM

I just hate this idea. If there is a challenge it should come from the captain.  I just hate the idea of inserting coaches into the game.

#39 MattPie

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 11:46 AM

View PostX. Benedict, on 10 June 2014 - 11:12 AM, said:

I just hate this idea. If there is a challenge it should come from the captain.  I just hate the idea of inserting coaches into the game.

I don't think I agree with that one, the Captain is even less likely to see something or have access to a replay. How many times do we see players motion that a goal was scored with a kick or high stick when the replay shows it clearly wasn't. I doubt coaches want to blow their only time-out on that.

#40 shrader

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 11:52 AM

View PostMattPie, on 10 June 2014 - 11:46 AM, said:

I don't think I agree with that one, the Captain is even less likely to see something or have access to a replay. How many times do we see players motion that a goal was scored with a kick or high stick when the replay shows it clearly wasn't. I doubt coaches want to blow their only time-out on that.

We also need an actual proposal before we can tell whether or not we like it.