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Is there any chance that trades will be made before deadline?


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#41 Potato

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Posted 10 October 2013 - 11:43 AM

Does anyone happen to know why Terry Pegula considers Darcy to be a "hockey genius" when 99.9% of the rest of us can see that he is not?

#42 thewookie1

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Posted 10 October 2013 - 11:56 AM

Deal Myers and Miller (50%) for Eberle and some depth goalie

Our team suddenly gets better due to the lack of Myers screw ups and Eberle's scoring ability

Miller to Enroth will hurt a little but the actual pain will be erased by the other two positives.

#43 MattPie

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Posted 10 October 2013 - 11:58 AM

Does anyone happen to know why Terry Pegula considers Darcy to be a "hockey genius" when 99.9% of the rest of us can see that he is not?


I think your (advanced) statistics are a bit off. 99.9% of the people bitching about Darcy think he's not. He's generally well-regarded around the league.

Personally, I could take or leave him, and am sliding towards leave.

#44 TrueBlueGED

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Posted 10 October 2013 - 03:03 PM

Does anyone happen to know why Terry Pegula considers Darcy to be a "hockey genius" when 99.9% of the rest of us can see that he is not?


Pretty sure it wasn't Pegula who said that. Besides, I think it's possible to know a ton about a sport and still fail miserably at assembling a consistently good team. There's plenty of examples across all sports.

#45 apuszczalowski

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Posted 10 October 2013 - 03:57 PM

I think your (advanced) statistics are a bit off. 99.9% of the people bitching about Darcy think he's not. He's generally well-regarded around the league.

Personally, I could take or leave him, and am sliding towards leave.

He is? I've never heard that before, I have heard that there are GMs that find him hard to deal with though

#46 Kristian

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Posted 10 October 2013 - 04:04 PM

I think your (advanced) statistics are a bit off. 99.9% of the people bitching about Darcy think he's not. He's generally well-regarded around the league.

Personally, I could take or leave him, and am sliding towards leave.


I always thought it was some sort of urban myth, based on the fact that no other GM's have actually talked bad about him.

I've heard it before, but the only times I've ever seen Darcy mentioned by other GM's it's been the usual "he's a good hockey guy", "knows the game well" stuff.

Pretty much what I would say to reporters if I were asked about the competition's GM, if I didn't have much to say about him.

#47 We've

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Posted 10 October 2013 - 04:33 PM

Pretty sure it wasn't Pegula who said that. Besides, I think it's possible to know a ton about a sport and still fail miserably at assembling a consistently good team. There's plenty of examples across all sports.


I seem to recall Pegs calling Darcy a genius or something like that. I don't recall him saying Darcy was a hockey genius though.

#48 Grinder

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Posted 10 October 2013 - 04:47 PM

Ken Sawyer is the one who called Darcy a hockey genius. It was probably right after Darcy educated him on the marketplace. Darcy is a master of marketplace education.

#49 Robviously

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Posted 10 October 2013 - 09:41 PM

Does anyone happen to know why Terry Pegula considers Darcy to be a "hockey genius" when 99.9% of the rest of us can see that he is not?

Because no one can tell him a single thing Darcy Regier has ever done wrong.

Regier is awesome. GM for life.

#50 HopefulFuture

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 08:34 AM

Beat me to it. DR has obviously sold TP on the rebuild/youth movement/patience/suffering approach. There is NFW DR gets fired during the year and frankly I think it would take something filthy that only GoDD would post about to get DR fired before the end of next season.

I agree with the rest of this post too, although I'm still hoping the Sabres aren't bad enough to draft that high.


I'll even go so far as to state the following.......
DR is fully aware of Vaneks value, not just for the full season, but at the deadline as well. I now firmly believe DR moves Vanek for a nice package, maybe not Pommer's nice, but I'm inclined to believe he's looking for an additional top 10 pick. That may mean the team/s interested in Vaneks service may have to make a trade to get that type of pick to sway DR.

Also, on Miller, I can't see him sticking around either, a combo package to Edmonton makes the most sense from a fans view, but DR may have his eyes on something else altogether.

In the end, 4 years from now minimum, fans should be much more excited about this team. I'm not really interested in the 14' draft class top picks, but Connor McDavid in 15', should he end up in the Sabres grip, would surely elevate the play of some of these young supporting type players we've picked up.
No, I don't believe we are on the right track yet, but if we can endure 2 to 3 seasons of losing, and losing heavy, the future looks brighter and brighter for us IMHO.

#51 nfreeman

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 09:14 AM

I'll even go so far as to state the following.......
DR is fully aware of Vaneks value, not just for the full season, but at the deadline as well. I now firmly believe DR moves Vanek for a nice package, maybe not Pommer's nice, but I'm inclined to believe he's looking for an additional top 10 pick. That may mean the team/s interested in Vaneks service may have to make a trade to get that type of pick to sway DR.

Also, on Miller, I can't see him sticking around either, a combo package to Edmonton makes the most sense from a fans view, but DR may have his eyes on something else altogether.

In the end, 4 years from now minimum, fans should be much more excited about this team. I'm not really interested in the 14' draft class top picks, but Connor McDavid in 15', should he end up in the Sabres grip, would surely elevate the play of some of these young supporting type players we've picked up.
No, I don't believe we are on the right track yet, but if we can endure 2 to 3 seasons of losing, and losing heavy, the future looks brighter and brighter for us IMHO.


But how can we possibly trust DR to make the right decisions in this rebuild?

#52 HopefulFuture

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 09:32 AM

But how can we possibly trust DR to make the right decisions in this rebuild?


Fair question nfreeman, and honestly, I don't. But, I also realize I have little options available to me as a Sabres fan at this moment.
All we can really do is support the team, even in it's current state of affairs while at the same time, as fans, voicing our displeasure with the continued presence of Regier.
After all, if we do end up with the 1st pick over all these next 2 seasons, it's kind of hard to F that up, even for Regier. But in the end, like yourself, I wouldn't put it past him.

#53 LGR4GM

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 11:51 AM

But how can we possibly trust DR to make the right decisions in this rebuild?

I no longer do. It seems hypocritical because I was preaching patience but I don't trust regier to rebuild.

#54 CallawaySabres

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 12:20 PM

I'll even go so far as to state the following.......
DR is fully aware of Vaneks value, not just for the full season, but at the deadline as well. I now firmly believe DR moves Vanek for a nice package, maybe not Pommer's nice, but I'm inclined to believe he's looking for an additional top 10 pick. That may mean the team/s interested in Vaneks service may have to make a trade to get that type of pick to sway DR.

Also, on Miller, I can't see him sticking around either, a combo package to Edmonton makes the most sense from a fans view, but DR may have his eyes on something else altogether.

In the end, 4 years from now minimum, fans should be much more excited about this team. I'm not really interested in the 14' draft class top picks, but Connor McDavid in 15', should he end up in the Sabres grip, would surely elevate the play of some of these young supporting type players we've picked up.
No, I don't believe we are on the right track yet, but if we can endure 2 to 3 seasons of losing, and losing heavy, the future looks brighter and brighter for us IMHO.


I could build a contender with 3 more "losing heavy" seasons. This pathetic bunch of hockey people is paid to make moves that actually help the team instead of setting them back constantly. If they rely on top draft picks over the next 3 years, they have already given up......

#55 Lorenzo Von Matterhorn

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 12:39 PM

Here's what needs to happen: The market for Miller is not high right now but it will be don't worry. There are several teams that will need a goalie to make a push later in the season and this is before we've seen any injuries to goalies. Teams like the Isles, Oilers, Lightning, Penguins, Capitals, Ducks and maybe even Philly since they are always aggressive. I just can't see Miller lasting here through the season, this team is too bad and he'll be the best goalie available someone will pay.

Also, not that anything can be done about it by us & it probably won't happen but Darcy really does need to be fired if he somehow makes it to the 14 draft not sure if I'll be able to come back to this team.

Not sure if this has been brought up before but I'd LOVE for us to take a long, hard look at Jason Botterill as the next GM. It should help that he spent some time in the organization. He's been brought along by one of the best franchises since the lockout & he's considered one of brightest young minds coming up through the ranks. He's the guy I want running the show ASAP.

EDIT: Not sure why I started that with here's what needs to happen but just let it happen anyway.

Edited by Lorenzo Von Matterhorn, 11 October 2013 - 12:40 PM.


#56 HopefulFuture

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 12:53 PM

I could build a contender with 3 more "losing heavy" seasons. This pathetic bunch of hockey people is paid to make moves that actually help the team instead of setting them back constantly. If they rely on top draft picks over the next 3 years, they have already given up......


Well, I don't look at high end draft picks (1 to 3 range) over the next 2 to 3 seasons as giving up. I look at it for what it is, a rebuild.
I don't however, disagree with your assessment on the hockey people statement. Something has had a bad smell in Sabres land for a long time now, and like yourself, as a fan, I'm pointing my finger at those hockey people as well.

#57 LGR4GM

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 01:08 PM

Jason Botterill
...now there is the first good idea for GM I have heard in a long while... he supposedly still leaves in the Rochester area (according to wikipedia)
http://en.wikipedia....Jason_Botterill

#58 (E5)

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 01:36 PM

But how can we possibly trust DR to make the right decisions in this rebuild?


Bingo.

I can name 25 NHL teams that have better prospects then Buffalo AND are not claiming they are going through a rebuild.

But hey, we should believe Darcy on this one.

Pegula is really looking like a bafoon. Amazing to think how far his star is fallen considering how he took over the Buffalo franchise.

Bingo.

I can name 25 NHL teams that have better prospects then Buffalo AND are not claiming they are going through a rebuild.

And Darcy should be trusted given his track record in the NHL Draft?

But hey, we should believe Darcy on this one.

Pegula is really looking like a bafoon. Amazing to think how far his star is fallen considering how he took over the Buffalo franchise.



#59 We've

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 01:41 PM

Bingo.

I can name 25 NHL teams that have better prospects then Buffalo AND are not claiming they are going through a rebuild.

But hey, we should believe Darcy on this one.

Pegula is really looking like a bafoon. Amazing to think how far his star is fallen considering how he took over the Buffalo franchise.


OK. Name them. and justify it. The folks that do that sort of thing for a living don't agree with it.

#60 Lorenzo Von Matterhorn

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 02:16 PM

Jason Botterill
...now there is the first good idea for GM I have heard in a long while... he supposedly still leaves in the Rochester area (according to wikipedia)
http://en.wikipedia....Jason_Botterill

Thank you I thought it was quite a good idea as well now if only Terry could read this because he most likely has no idea Jason Botterill exists

#61 Ghost of Dwight Drane

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 02:37 PM

OK. Name them. and justify it. The folks that do that sort of thing for a living don't agree with it.


What do you consider a prospect? What's more valuable...a 19 year old who has shown zero at the NHL level, or 23-26 year olds who have won a Norris, a Stanley Cup, and have forced a 7 goal, 20 point big center who is 20 years old to the AHL? Because that pretty much describes Ottawa, who has tons of cap room besides.

The Sabres have out of the money options on talent. Nothing capable now, but MAYBE in 2-5 years. Meanwhile, plenty of teams are loaded with 20-26 year olds who seem to progress and make their team competitive, and should be that way for the next 3-10 years.

We are so far behind the curve it isn't funny. If you stick with the current strategy, you need 3 years just to HOPE you can compete for a playoff spot and maybe win a round.

Thank you I thought it was quite a good idea as well now if only Terry could read this because he most likely has no idea Jason Botterill exists


The names Bucky has touted the past few years makes sense in a sort of 3 headed monster. Dudley/Botterill/Lafontaine.

Dudley likes to stay behind the scenes, but is a good talent evaluator and architect. Let him strategize, Botterill does a lot of the leg work and maybe oversees the scouting department and such. And Lafontaine is the public face that is 100% respected and trusted by players and fans alike. He could be the liaison between the hockey and business department, between Rochester and Buffalo, and between the team and the public for important hockey matters.

I'm not sure if it would be a case of too many cooks, but they all could be highly efficient at a key role. If Patty tells me we need to be patient, I'll handle it. If Darcy tells me that, I want a stray meteor to strike the podium.

There are plenty of options out there, but if Pegula is intent on coddling ex-Sabres, this is at least a B+ solution given an open market.

#62 Lorenzo Von Matterhorn

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 02:53 PM

The names Bucky has touted the past few years makes sense in a sort of 3 headed monster. Dudley/Botterill/Lafontaine.

Dudley likes to stay behind the scenes, but is a good talent evaluator and architect. Let him strategize, Botterill does a lot of the leg work and maybe oversees the scouting department and such. And Lafontaine is the public face that is 100% respected and trusted by players and fans alike. He could be the liaison between the hockey and business department, between Rochester and Buffalo, and between the team and the public for important hockey matters.

I'm not sure if it would be a case of too many cooks, but they all could be highly efficient at a key role. If Patty tells me we need to be patient, I'll handle it. If Darcy tells me that, I want a stray meteor to strike the podium.

There are plenty of options out there, but if Pegula is intent on coddling ex-Sabres, this is at least a B+ solution given an open market.

LOL at the 3rd line so true.....I think having all 3 would be amazing but unlikely I think a combo of Patty & Botterill could work though, Botterill working as the GM to construct the cap & give Patty a position like the Avs gave Sakic VP of Hockey Operations? I don't know but it would be nice to have Patty as a figurehead to bring some respect to this franchise.

#63 TrueBlueGED

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 02:53 PM

What do you consider a prospect? What's more valuable...a 19 year old who has shown zero at the NHL level, or 23-26 year olds who have won a Norris, a Stanley Cup, and have forced a 7 goal, 20 point big center who is 20 years old to the AHL? Because that pretty much describes Ottawa, who has tons of cap room besides.

The Sabres have out of the money options on talent. Nothing capable now, but MAYBE in 2-5 years. Meanwhile, plenty of teams are loaded with 20-26 year olds who seem to progress and make their team competitive, and should be that way for the next 3-10 years.

We are so far behind the curve it isn't funny. If you stick with the current strategy, you need 3 years just to HOPE you can compete for a playoff spot and maybe win a round.



The names Bucky has touted the past few years makes sense in a sort of 3 headed monster. Dudley/Botterill/Lafontaine.

Dudley likes to stay behind the scenes, but is a good talent evaluator and architect. Let him strategize, Botterill does a lot of the leg work and maybe oversees the scouting department and such. And Lafontaine is the public face that is 100% respected and trusted by players and fans alike. He could be the liaison between the hockey and business department, between Rochester and Buffalo, and between the team and the public for important hockey matters.

I'm not sure if it would be a case of too many cooks, but they all could be highly efficient at a key role. If Patty tells me we need to be patient, I'll handle it. If Darcy tells me that, I want a stray meteor to strike the podium.

There are plenty of options out there, but if Pegula is intent on coddling ex-Sabres, this is at least a B+ solution given an open market.


I'm not sure how you can go about dumping on the value of prospects, and then purport to trust LaFontaine in a management capacity--where he himself would be nothing more than a prospect.

#64 thewookie1

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 03:27 PM

Supposedly Claude Giroux is very unhappy with Philly, what would you be willing to give up to grab him? I'd personally try to hold onto Hodgson and trade Grigo + Miller. Obviously you'd need to take salary back but that's easy.

#65 inkman

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 03:29 PM

Supposedly Claude Giroux is very unhappy with Philly, what would you be willing to give up to grab him? I'd personally try to hold onto Hodgson and trade Grigo + Miller. Obviously you'd need to take salary back but that's easy.

Anyone in the organization, make that any two in the org.

#66 nfreeman

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 03:35 PM

Supposedly Claude Giroux is very unhappy with Philly, what would you be willing to give up to grab him? I'd personally try to hold onto Hodgson and trade Grigo + Miller. Obviously you'd need to take salary back but that's easy.


...and you continue to cement your stranglehold on the "most trade ideas from outer space" award formerly held by LGR.

#67 d4rksabre

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 03:41 PM

...and you continue to cement your stranglehold on the "most trade ideas from outer space" award formerly held by LGR.


:lol:

#68 Ghost of Dwight Drane

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 03:49 PM

I'm not sure how you can go about dumping on the value of prospects, and then purport to trust LaFontaine in a management capacity--where he himself would be nothing more than a prospect.


Sort of like the Bills brought in Marv Levy after Donahoe. You are close to a full fledged fan revolt. The secondary ticket market is telling the story. People can't give seats away 2 weeks into the season.

I don't know if Lafontaine would be interested in a role like that as he would have the least amount of power of the 3. I'm just saying...what we know of Pegula, he likes "HIS" people. And when it comes to hockey, the best we can hope for it seems is HS people being ex-Sabres. This seems like a viable idea given reality.

#69 TrueBlueGED

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 03:51 PM

Sort of like the Bills brought in Marv Levy after Donahoe. You are close to a full fledged fan revolt. The secondary ticket market is telling the story. People can't give seats away 2 weeks into the season.

I don't know if Lafontaine would be interested in a role like that as he would have the least amount of power of the 3. I'm just saying...what we know of Pegula, he likes "HIS" people. And when it comes to hockey, the best we can hope for it seems is HS people being ex-Sabres. This seems like a viable idea given reality.


Fair enough. I thought you were advocating for it, which I found weird. But framed in light of Pegula's apparent tendencies, that makes much more sense.

#70 thewookie1

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 03:55 PM

...and you continue to cement your stranglehold on the "most trade ideas from outer space" award formerly held by LGR.


I'd like to thank my parents for raising me, the Sabres for sucking, and my imagination.




Thewookie1's masterful plan:

Trade Miller(50%), Myers & 3rd rounder to Edmonton for Eberle & a 2nd rounder

Offer Enroth, Grigs, McNabb/Ruhwedal & a 2 2nd rounders for Giroux

Offer a 2nd and 4th rounder to Toronto for Reimer

Offer Stafford + a 4th rounder to a team for a 2nd rounder

Ask Vanek if would like to stay, if Giroux and Eberle can't make him happy deal him for a 1st round + prospects.


I have just teared up the Sabres roster.



#71 TrueBlueGED

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 04:01 PM

My brain...

#72 thewookie1

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 04:04 PM

My brain...


To be honest only the 1st one has a chance in theory

#73 Ghost of Dwight Drane

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 04:06 PM

Fair enough. I thought you were advocating for it, which I found weird. But framed in light of Pegula's apparent tendencies, that makes much more sense.


From Day 1 I was scared that Pegula would trust status quo too much, we'd end up where we are, and fans would end up turning on Pegula himself. If the team isn't winning and he's not having fun, AND the fans turn on him for real....this can be a disaster.

I'm hoping Pegula can reflect a bit and see that Darcy just can't cut it, for as much as he likes him as a person. Lafontaine would be a face and name that fans trust, and he may actually have enough ability to be a true asset in the personnel department. I still want a "General" type here, planning behind the scenes. Sadly, the further down the hole we go, and the more that Pegula becomes a quantified owner, and not just speculation about him, it can be harder to get people of value in here.

We are getting close to a situation of no-return. I'm not sure how likely that is to happen, but the dynamics are in place. Firing Regier would gain forgiveness from just about everyone, including myself. Just as long as he doesn't go batsh!t crazy and bring in someone with zero clue again.

#74 dudacek

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 07:32 PM

So if I am getting this right, the Sabres getting off to their worst start in history could actually be a good thing...
And right now I need to be happy... :huh:

#75 bunomatic

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 09:24 PM

Here's what needs to happen: The market for Miller is not high right now but it will be don't worry. There are several teams that will need a goalie to make a push later in the season and this is before we've seen any injuries to goalies. Teams like the Isles, Oilers, Lightning, Penguins, Capitals, Ducks and maybe even Philly since they are always aggressive. I just can't see Miller lasting here through the season, this team is too bad and he'll be the best goalie available someone will pay.

Also, not that anything can be done about it by us & it probably won't happen but Darcy really does need to be fired if he somehow makes it to the 14 draft not sure if I'll be able to come back to this team.

Not sure if this has been brought up before but I'd LOVE for us to take a long, hard look at Jason Botterill as the next GM. It should help that he spent some time in the organization. He's been brought along by one of the best franchises since the lockout & he's considered one of brightest young minds coming up through the ranks. He's the guy I want running the show ASAP.

EDIT: Not sure why I started that with here's what needs to happen but just let it happen anyway.


Your plan goes up in smoke if Miller gets injured and negates his value to somebody to ZERO and in so doing negates his worth to us to ZERO because we lose him to free agency without seeing anything of value coming back. Everythings aligning towards a shittstorm of Regierosity right now.

#76 JJFIVEOH

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 09:25 PM

SabresBuzz@SabresBuzz 8m
Dallas starting G Kari Lehtonen left game tonight in P2 with a lower body injury. He will not return tonight.

#77 waldo

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 09:26 PM

So if I am getting this right, the Sabres getting off to their worst start in history could actually be a good thing...
And right now I need to be happy... :huh:


:D

#78 nfreeman

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Posted 12 October 2013 - 12:16 AM

Your plan goes up in smoke if Miller gets injured and negates his value to somebody to ZERO and in so doing negates his worth to us to ZERO because we lose him to free agency without seeing anything of value coming back. Everythings aligning towards a shittstorm of Regierosity right now.


I don't agree with the first part, because I think the time to get the best price for Miller will be at the deadline, but the bolded part is excellent.

SabresBuzz@SabresBuzz 8m
Dallas starting G Kari Lehtonen left game tonight in P2 with a lower body injury. He will not return tonight.


Now that is good information.

#79 JJFIVEOH

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Posted 12 October 2013 - 12:35 AM

Now that is good information.


Is that sarcasm?

#80 freester

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Posted 12 October 2013 - 05:38 AM

We need to trade Miller now. With our dreadful defense, he will have a 4 goals against average and everyone will think he is done. We need to trade Myers now for a bag of pucks. The more he plays the worse he looks.